Why do Femmes push/pull?

[KShawn]

Butches do this too but I'm wondering why Femmes do the push/pull thing.

While trying to find the right lady to date and hopefully develop a relationship with I have found that many run away. Why is that? Doesn't she want to be caught? Once caught, doesn't she want to be kept?

It is so confusing to me to figure out - am I suppose to give chase? Chase for a little while then give up? When do I cross the line and it becomes harrassment? Or if I give up too soon and it is interpeted as not being interested which is NOT the message I want her to get. There is a very fine line and it differs from person to person.

Maybe I am too literal but if a woman wants me to leave her alone - I leave her alone then she gets mad at me because I didn't care enough to give chase. I can't figure it out!?!?!

I fear that I am doomed to always be single!

[svairini]

Originally posted by KShawn
Maybe I am too literal but if a woman wants me to leave her alone - I leave her alone then she gets mad at me because I didn't care enough to give chase.

If you want to go out with a drama queen, you could learn how to chase these girls.

But if you want someone who doesn't play those games, I think you're doing the right thing. If you're clear about your intent, you deserve a clear and honest response.

After a 4-year relationship with someone (butch) who did the push/pull thing, lemme tell ya, I am so over that. I don't go out with anyone who is less than 100% excited to go out with me, especially at the beginning! If a person is ambivalent in the beginning, when you're supposed to be in the flush of falling in love/lust/etc, it doesn't get better with time. (Once they discover all my flaws, I can tolerate some ambivalence, lol.) That's my experience, anyway.

Good luck.

[TrueBlueButch]

Originally posted by svairini
If you're clear about your intent, you deserve a clear and honest response.

I don't go out with anyone who is less than 100% excited to go out with me, especially at the beginning! If a person is ambivalent in the beginning, when you're supposed to be in the flush of falling in love/lust/etc, it doesn't get better with time. (Once they discover all my flaws, I can tolerate some ambivalence, lol.) Good luck.

Thanks for the thread...listen to this woman, she knows of what she speaks.
It takes awhile to figure out that people do not feel as you do. I try to give every opportunity before bowing out. Some women are afraid, some are shy, some just want to keep their options open...and some just need the ego boost of having more than one butch hanging on the line. Sometimes it's just a game...sometimes it's a genuine need to take some time.

But, the reality is, if it's all one way...the energy, the calls, the emails the attempts at spending authentic time together...run, do not walk to the nearest exit.
As for clarity and honesty...LOL I have known some women who say how they are being very clear and very honest...LOL Believe me when I say they are as clear as mud. You cannot get a straight (forgive me) answer...but the ambibuity sounds so lovely coming from a set of pretty lips.
I guess it comes down to loving yourself enough to be willing to bend...but not break.

Take Care,

Blue

[Rainbow Skittles]

Originally posted by svairini
If a person is ambivalent in the beginning, when you're supposed to be in the flush of falling in love/lust/etc, it doesn't get better with time.

<resisting from giving a shout of AMEN>

I, for one, hate game playing. If you can't lay it out on the table then for me there is no basis for a relationship. If I feel like I have to play games with you or that you are the type of person that needs me to play games with you....then faghetaboutit....

I believe that there are some people out there that need you to play the game with them. There are some butches (and probably femmes too) that if they get you too easy then they don't appreciate what they've got.

I am really lucky, cause my butch is too experienced at life and love to be about game playing. I don't need to play games because hye is confident enough in hymself to not need the drama. And love without drama is a wonderful thing!

[KShawn]

Originally posted by svairini
If you want to go out with a drama queen, you could learn how to chase these girls.

But if you want someone who doesn't play those games, I think you're doing the right thing. If you're clear about your intent, you deserve a clear and honest response.

Thank you for the wonderful advice!

I thought that within time they would relax and be secure by not running. My ex of 8 years ran and I dated another woman off and on (mainly off) for 7 years who is a runner. Now that I am attempting to date again I am finding even more runners with each one I start to get serious about. Makes me wonder what I am projecting that says "runners welcome!"

Is running away a honest response? Is it reject before being rejected? Do I somehow give the impression that I intend to drop her eventually? I just don't get the value of the "game."

[FemmePhotographer]

....Is that what you call it? I didn't realize there was a "term" for it. I guess that's how naive I am...

[KShawn]

Originally posted by FemmePhotographer
....Is that what you call it? I didn't realize there was a "term" for it. I guess that's how naive I am...

Hmm, good question. <shrug> If there is an official term I do not know what it is. My intent and meaning seems to be clear. However, if there is a better way to ask my question, I am open to suggestions.

[oregon_femme]

Hello, I would like to add my two-cents worth. Although I am extremely new at all this, I do have a few comments.
First, I do not think it is all cut and dry. No two Femmes are exactly alike, and everyone has different reasons and justifications for what they do.
I believe down deep we are all seeking happiness. We do have that one common goal. But the way we "get there" ( or if we ever do) depends on so many factors.
As for me, I am a Runner. I have run away from quite a few willing Butchs. Most of them I ran away from BEFORE they could pin me down on the bed! I find that alot of Butchs are just looking for sex. Instant gratification. And they will say and do anything to get you into bed. Promise you the moon.
That is what some of us Femmes are used to, just another Butch with a story they think we want to hear, so we become untrusting, disbelieving.
Then when someone TRUE comes along, we are so tainted, that we can't see that it could be REAL.
Another factor that comes to mind with "running" is the one you mentioned, Shawn. "Is it reject before being rejected?" Some femmes have gotten used to the fact that thier dream Butch will leave after the honeymoon phase is over. So, perhaps the femme tries to hide her emotions so she wont feel so vunerable and foolish when the Butch never calls again.
I have been talking and emailing with what appears to be the most perfect Butch on Gods green earth. Everything could go so smooth, if only I would stop pushing and pulling Him back, and playing games. Something I am working on. I just hope I get the problem fixed before He starts the running process on His end, and I never hear from Him again.
*Pamela*

[TrueBlueButch]

Okay, I just have to say something to this because this is not the first time I've heard it and it honestly offends me.
This statement that most butches are just looking for sex....are there any other butches that find this presumption to be really demeaning...not to mention sexist...not to mention it's a complete generalization...and a real cop out?

Here's the facts... there are butches and femmes of all sorts; poly and monogamous, kinky and straight, outgoing and introverted...I refuse to believe that sex is all that "most" butches want. Yes, I do believe that attraction is what brings us together. Lust has it's place..it is the thing that turns our heads and makes us want to spend time with someone. And, before anyone says anything, I know there are those who say they are attracted to someone's soul. And what really angers me is the presumption that should someone, a butch in this case, be attracted to a woman that that, in some way, invalidates any potential for something deeper...that is absurd.

I really don't know how it works for everyone else but for me...I am not attracted sexually to every woman who crosses my path. When I am sexually attracted to a woman it is a very unusual and rare thing. And most often, I am never attracted to someone purely on looks...in fact, I can honestly say NEVER here. There absolutely has to be something more...something that draws me from deep inside...her personality, her essence rings a chord deep inside me. Sexually...sure, I might want to hold her, to touch her and perhaps make love to her...that is about my desire to be close to her, to know her...and mostly, to allow her to really know me. Sex is vulnerable. It is intimate and it is spiritual FOR ME. I have no desire to bed every woman I think is pretty.

Ooo, I just derailed, didn't I. Okay, back on track...I watch very closely when I am intersted in someone...their actions will speak much louder than their words...If they are afraid, pensive, broken or playin', greedy for attention, unable to be accountable, waiting on the BBD (bigger, better deal)...give it some time and it will all float to the surface eventually. Mostly, my advice...do not wait by the phone...do ask other women out...do remain consistant with them...and do not be surprised when they suddenly turn up in an overnight relationship with "the Daddy of their dreams" (please!!!)


I think the Supremes said it best...

"Set me free, whay don't you babe?

Get outta my life, why don't you babe?

You don't really love me....

You just keep me hanging on..."

OMG...someone save me...I am quoting Motown...argh!!!!!

Blue

[mephistopholes]

Good thread - gives me something to think about. I don't have any answers but I think what TBB said is very valuable information. I suppose there can be as many reasons as there are people for why the "push-pull" thing happens and I can only say for me that I have done this when I move too quickly in a relationship and find myself not ready for the next level but convince myself to go forward anyway.

I think it takes a lot of us a long time to be able to see this clearly. Thanks for the thread and thanks again TBB, what you have to say is always so valuable to me.

Mephistopholes....

[oregon_femme]

Well, I do stand corrected! And thank you, Blue for pointing out my mistake. I did generalize all Butchs. And that was wrong. I think my problem is that I was attracting the sort of Butch that only wants "one thing" by the way I was putting things out there. I am so new at all this, and I am stumbling and making lots of mistakes. This thread is helping me see things more clearly. So, thanks!
I want to apologize, especially to Shawn and TrueBlue for lumping you in that group, when obviously you two Gentleman are not that way at all. I will be more careful and this will be yet another lesson in my quickly growing list of lessons.
*Pamela*

[XxSkittlesxX]

Just two cents from a reformed runner:

I agree with the above posts about game playing. If you're just playing games for your own enjoyment, or "just because" it's bs and just not cool. But it's not always as simple as that. Where your perception might be that she is playing some sort of mind game, there could be deep-seated reasons for her actions.
Here's my experience, and you can take or leave what you want from it:
I've run in the past for a few different reasons.

1. To prove to myself that I could. That I was still independent of this person. After so many years of looking out for yourself, and having only yourself to really rely on, and basically.. keeping everyone out of your heart until you forgot thats what it's there for... it's really scary when you find yourself in love. That means putting someone before yourself. It also means leaning on them. And when it gets to the point of your feeling, God how can I live with out this person... I felt like I was drowning in it all and I needed to prove to myself that I was still independent. That I was all I needed. Now.. I'm not saying that I was a complete idiot for thinking this way... and I've since realized why I did things that way and learned from my mistakes but never the less that's why I did it.

2. Another thing... I push and push and push at my partner. It's like a back and forth process. I was conditioned during my childhood that feelings were not to be shown, and if you did slip up... and show some emotion... they would be thrown in front of a spotlight and ridiculed. So needless to say.. It's been a hard lesson to learn to share my feelings.

When I do share them though... I feel vulnerable and that is a feeling that I react negatively to and so the next phase is the push phase. I push away at my butch while inside I'm frantically trying to do damage control and rebuild my calm strong exterior.

Also I push to see if they'll push back. I've been in relationships where I've pushed once and that was all it took to send them packing. I need to know that they are committed to making us work. That they'll fight for us, before I can invest myself 100%.

That may be what some people think of as game playing but... to me, it's just trying to get by with as little damage to my heart as possible.

[KShawn]

Originally posted by XxSkittlesxX
Just two cents from a reformed runner:
<snipped>
That may be what some people think of as game playing but... to me, it's just trying to get by with as little damage to my heart as possible.

Skittles,

I appreciate you taking the time to explain why you use to run. And the reasoning you provided is understandable. I’m just not convinced that running or pushing away from something that is actually wanted is the best way to find out the things you mentioned even though I found myself nodding in agreement with what you wrote.

I can also understand why running and pushing are seen as game playing because a runner is not being direct with what is really going on thus they are playing a game.

I have recently realized that I too tend to push people away but it has to do with my comfort zones. As long as things progress “naturally” I am fine and don’t go into panic mode. It’s when I’m feeling pressured or coerced/manipulated to do something that my warning signals go off and I need to put some distance there. It isn’t that I am rejecting the individual - I am trying to get back in balance.

It is too easy to be swept up in the heat of the moment or let the hormones take over before sanity snaps back into play. I agree that if they take off then they obviously never wanted to be there in the first place unless they have been pushed away so many times that they feel unwanted. I think there is a very fine line in the perception of if that was a push for comfort or a shove for get away from me!

I do not always realize I am pushing someone away from me or taking a step back. Then when it is pointed out to me, of course hurt feelings are involved and all kinds of issues come to the surface. Questions like, “How can my love for you make you uncomfortable?” are two-edged where even hesitating too long gets you in hot water!

KShawn – still trying to comprehend the whole thing!

[oregon_femme]

*Bump*

This was such an interesting thread, I thought I would bump it back to life.


Looking back, at me, I sure was confused back then!

But it was fun walking down memory lane.



I have since learned that its the FEMMES who only want one thing!
snicker....just kidding!

[NlightNed_butch]

Is this the same thing as 'running'? Is there a thread on that? because it seems all I come across lately is femmes running, in the opposite direction.
This is one thing I can't figure out, although I know they have their own personal reasons.

I think FEAR is the one of the main reasons. Fear of getting hurt mostly. But when you establish some kind of bond with someone and they run, you kind of want to know why, what the real deal was for the running.

I'll be glad when I find a non-runner.

[Midnight Blue]

Someone needs to define "running" for me. To me, just because I don't always jump headlong into dating or wild and crazy love doesn't mean I'm "running."

My butch will tell you that she was more engaged with the idea of us dating than I was. I think it's not unusual at the beginning for one person to be more excited than the other about the idea of dating. I'm seldom 100% excited about dating *anyone* at first -- I don't know them well enough to be that excited.

When I start dating someone, I keep up a few "walls." I've had some pretty bad dating experiences, like most people, and I'd rather not be badly hurt. I don't think that's running -- I think that's the difference between being a 16 year old in love for the first time and being a *ahem* mature woman who has some experience. To me, this isn't running -- it's taking things slowly.

In my opinion, the problem arises if someone (whether butch or femme), over time, refuses to start letting down those walls. To me, *that's* running. I dated a butch once who would sign his emails to me "Love -- X" -- but the minute I ever signed mine "Love -- Me," he'd go back to signing his with "Cheers!" He never would really let down those walls, even after months. Everytime I got close, he ran.

I guess the bottom line is, I'm lucky my butch didn't give up. She was consistent in letting me know how interested she was. Pretty soon, I *was* 100% excited about us dating.

[Trusage]

Hi Midnight,
I'm on the opposite end of what you are describing. Walls....damn, my girl has a moat, razor wire and a couple of snipers up there...how do I get her to open back up?

[GemmeFemme]

Push and pull....passive aggressive....running and chasing....whatever terms you wish to apply...has primarily been a knee jerk reaction for me. The reasons have changed throughout the various relationships, including being pushed too far too soon in the scheme of things (U~Haul Syndrome and all that), having my boundaries obliterated, as well as the gut~clenching fear of being vulnerable. Vulnerability is a weakness and it's very hard to show another your weak spots for fear of being exploited one way or another.

In my current relationship, I genuinely feel safe and want to continue to reach new depths of intimacy and trust with my husbutch, but I have a great deal of baggage from my childhood that sometimes sneaks up on me and I react instinctively, not rationally. So, I wind up pushing away the person I need and want to hold close. It's not unusual in the least, but it is certainly hurtful to both partners, even when they know the reasons behind the behavior.

The 'whys' are quite varied and complex, but if the other person cares enough to stick around to find out the reason or is open to trying new behaviors, it could work.

[NlightNed_butch]

Push and pull....passive aggressive....running and chasing....whatever terms you wish to apply...has primarily been a knee jerk reaction for me. The reasons have changed throughout the various relationships, including being pushed too far too soon in the scheme of things (U~Haul Syndrome and all that), having my boundaries obliterated, as well as the gut~clenching fear of being vulnerable. Vulnerability is a weakness and it's very hard to show another your weak spots for fear of being exploited one way or another.

In my current relationship, I genuinely feel safe and want to continue to reach new depths of intimacy and trust with my husbutch, but I have a great deal of baggage from my childhood that sometimes sneaks up on me and I react instinctively, not rationally. So, I wind up pushing away the person I need and want to hold close. It's not unusual in the least, but it is certainly hurtful to both partners, even when they know the reasons behind the behavior.

The 'whys' are quite varied and complex, but if the other person cares enough to stick around to find out the reason or is open to trying new behaviors, it could work.

Ahhh, wise words of wisdom from my dear friend Gemme. And what you say makes sense. I just wish ppl weren't so afraid to take a chance. There is so much to be missed with trying to interact with others because of fear.

Thank you Gemme.... many hugz.

[akadyke]

::: subscribing :::

wow, thanks o.f for bumping this back up... i will be back to read more and to add a comment.

a.

[GemmeFemme]

Ahhh, wise words of wisdom from my dear friend Gemme. And what you say makes sense. I just wish ppl weren't so afraid to take a chance. There is so much to be missed with trying to interact with others because of fear.

Thank you Gemme.... many hugz.

Sondi! Big hugs right back atcha.

You are right, of course, about missing stuff. Sometimes, those gut reactions are created in a hostile environment and are required for survival. After a while, it's near impossible to just turn them off. They become a part of you, so in order to change your behavior, you have to change a part of your core survival instincts.

Of course, as mentioned earlier, there are those who *do* play games. To those, I have only disgust and pity.

BUT

There are lots of butches and femmes who are just trying to live their lives by the means that they know works. They are willing to change and to open up, but it takes a great deal of patience and love for it to happen.

[Bekko]

not all femmes "push/pull" I think you're just chasing the wrong ones. Most femmes I know, know what they want and have no trouble telling a butch.

[NlightNed_butch]

Sondi! Big hugs right back atcha.

You are right, of course, about missing stuff. Sometimes, those gut reactions are created in a hostile environment and are required for survival. After a while, it's near impossible to just turn them off. They become a part of you, so in order to change your behavior, you have to change a part of your core survival instincts.

Of course, as mentioned earlier, there are those who *do* play games. To those, I have only disgust and pity.

BUT

There are lots of butches and femmes who are just trying to live their lives by the means that they know works. They are willing to change and to open up, but it takes a great deal of patience and love for it to happen.

My, how you've grown up to be so smart and wise! Now I've seen why I came to you for advice in the past.

Do you still charge a fee? LOL

[KShawn]

Someone needs to define "running" for me. To me, just because I don't always jump headlong into dating or wild and crazy love doesn't mean I'm "running." <snipped>

Since the question was originally mine I wanted to clarify what I meant. By running I mean, you both have expressed sole interest in one another but for whatever reason(s) she calls things off. Whether it's because she gets a case of cold feet or fear that you'll hurt her or leave her or who knows what. In my mind when you commit to another person you also commit to work on the issues that come up and that you don’t run away from the relationship the first chance you get. Unless of course it wasn’t really what you wanted after all.

There may even be legitimate reasons for her to run but the point is she won't talk to you and try to find out what really is going on because she is reacting to her fears of what she thinks "might" happen not what has happened. Does that make sense? It seems like it is not based on a real or rational reason. It’s as if she will not believe in you no matter what you do. Then you reach a point where you crack under the pressure of always being accused of lying or cheating or not loving her or whatever the accusations are – the point is THEY ARE FALSE. Regardless of that you’re treated as if you are guilty of doing something wrong or not good enough at what you are doing. My question is, How do I counter all of that and show I am sincere?

The following events recently happened and I can understand why she ran from me. Prior to this one instance, I am at a loss because I tried from the moment we meant to prove my loyalty and devotion to only her. She often ran and never believed in me no matter how hard I tried. I have retained all the emails to show that I was sincere in my intent. Granted, when I get upset I either shut down or sometimes I say things I do not mean. In either case I accept the fact that I helped to cause the insecurity and ruin everything I worked so hard to achieve.

Other people planted the seed of doubt by suggesting that the woman I was with was potentially using me financially. I typically do not believe what people tell me preferring to go by my own experiences but then more and more things provided proof they were right. She started withdrawing from me, she never really moved into the house we shared and she stopped talking things over when we use to communicate so well before. All these things can be explained (and were by her parents) as being caused by other things going on for her.

But then when I lost my job, I felt even more worthless and was scared to death I could not provide for her and her kids and soon thereafter she left me. Based on all this when she started doubting me again (a daily occurrence) even after all I did to prove otherwise I admit I was deeply hurt that nothing I did was good enough for her to ever believe in me. During our last argument I panicked and opened my big ugly mouth and threatened to help her ex get something from her. I never meant it and I will regret those hateful words for the rest of my life. I do not know her ex nor have done anything even close to hurt her or her kids. As a result she has attacked me over and over again yet I have done nothing to retaliate nor have I or will I ever follow through on that threat. It isn’t who I am and if she knew me better she would realize I wouldn’t hurt her. But now I can only hope that eventually she realizes that. She never believed in me before so I’m certain it is hopeless she will ever believe I loved her unconditionally and could never hurt her.

KShawn – Before everyone tells me how much I screwed up let me say that I know I was wrong and I am paying the price with not only a broken heart but more trouble than I ever thought possible especially from someone who claimed I was the love of her life. The twist of fate is a self-imposed bitter pill I continue to choke on. It has been a hard lesson but please know that I do accept total responsibility for what has happened. Not that I have to answer to anyone on this site but I feel it is important to acknowledge my responsibility in what has happened to me.

[BecknCallButch]

KShawn – Before everyone tells me how much I screwed up let me say that I know I was wrong and I am paying the price with not only a broken heart but more trouble than I ever thought possible especially from someone who claimed I was the love of her life. The twist of fate is a self-imposed bitter pill I continue to choke on. It has been a hard lesson but please know that I do accept total responsibility for what has happened. Not that I have to answer to anyone on this site but I feel it is important to acknowledge my responsibility in what has happened to me.

Nothing is worse or sadder than living your life with regrets over what you did or didn't do during your life time. It is unfortunate that we cannot undo the sins we regret even the verbal ones that we never intended to follow through with. The best you can do is ask for forgiveness and hope that the love is strong and deep enough to get past the issues to eventually grow and flourish inspite of it all!

I pray for a deep and ever lasting love! BecknCallButch!

[honeybarbara]

I've usually been "the chased" person. In that someone will be going full-bore "I want you" far FAR to early for me in the r'ship.

I'm very slow moving. I fall in love slowly. It takes me about 6 to 8 months to start to fall in love. Or longer. I like things to move slow... taking time... getting to know each other...

but many times, MOST of the time, the butch I'm seeing wants to move at break neck speed (to me) towards "forever and ever, I love you I love you I love you" after two or three months.

this scares the shit out of me and I can't understand why someone could possibly think they love me after only knowing me for three months. Or never even having MET me yet. they love the *idea* they have of me. not the me I really am. So I tend to back up.

that doesn't mean I don't want them. I usually feel very confused at this point. I enjoy them, and I know if we keep going slowly forward I *will* fall in love with them (I don't date people with intent if I know I'm not, at some point, going to fall for them).

Unfortunately, this usually makes people's resolve stronger and they chase harder. Something about me being hesitant, confused and scared, wanting but not willing, not so quick buster, really makes most of the butches I've dated, turn up the volume.

it's like getting obsessive, or something. their feelings of limerance get amplified or something...

anyway... I'd rather

I have recently realized that I too tend to push people away but it has to do with my comfort zones. As long as things progress “naturally” I am fine and don’t go into panic mode. It’s when I’m feeling pressured or coerced/manipulated to do something that my warning signals go off and I need to put some distance there. It isn’t that I am rejecting the individual - I am trying to get back in balance

do something along those lines.

But I think, after finally dating someone who doesn't push me faster than I'm ready... who is actually going at the same pace I am... I'm really enjoying this slow ride that allows me to think, keep my space, keep my wits about me and drift along with them in a nice slow boat up a canal... rather than screaming they love me from a power boat and pelting me with roses.

[BecknCallButch]

As I have been told...NEVER love anyone more than you love yourself! It is rare to find someone who genuinely will love you for you let alone love you to the same degree that you love them.

BecknCallButch - A firm believer in love and loving unconditionally!

[nihilisia]

When I saw the subject line of this thread - I thought maybe I'd qualify as a femme who does this. But the description doesn't really describe me.

I would say -

If a femme shows a lot of interest and then backs off, I wonder if it could sometimes be a "tag-your-it" thing. Because we femmes have to make ourselves so obvious sometimes just so you butches know we aren't straight. But if you're the kind of girl who gets a lot of pleasure from being pursued, you may back off once you get make yourself known.

Mixed signals may just mean mixed feelings / ambivalence, though. Maybe she wants to be convinced by you, or maybe she has you on her back burner.

Or, it could be like anti-lock breaks. You don't want to go too fast, you don't want to skid on the ice.

There are a million possible reasons really.

But, if you don't know whether to pursue or not, pay attention to the tone of her voice when you call her. Try to pin her down - ask her do do something specific at a specific time. If she's not interested in doing it, and she doesn't offer an alternative and/or sound interested, then I wouldn't waste my time.

That being said, there is a natural ebb and flow to human interaction. Without it, I personally would be bored.

[DarkFlaAngel1984]

Well, I never thought about it like this, But I guess I went out with one of these people...I was 17 when I got with my first gf,she was 24. And at first she didnt run at all, We started a relationship, (met online) she moved for me.. She got a place, and i ended up moving in with her soon after, Anyways,

After about 7months she broke it up,and left...Then called me sayin she wanted me back,then not. Then did... off and on.. Then we didnt talk for 2months, then 2months later she called, we hung out a couple of times, and got back together...
Then 6months later, we were off again. Stopped talking for 4months, then we got back together.. That was the last time i ever took her back..Because after 5months, She broke it off again but this time leaving me for someone else.. She wanted me back amonth later which lasted a week, then didnt. After that, the next time she said she wanted me back, I said No.... And i got with my gf who i love very much..

My ex played that game with me for a 2yrs and 4months..It isnt fun...Trust me if they leave u and then want u back,then dont and on and on if they even start that....My advice to u is
RUNNN....FAST!!!!

[citybutch]

I've usually been "the chased" person. In that someone will be going full-bore "I want you" far FAR to early for me in the r'ship.

I'm very slow moving. I fall in love slowly. It takes me about 6 to 8 months to start to fall in love. Or longer. I like things to move slow... taking time... getting to know each other...

but many times, MOST of the time, the butch I'm seeing wants to move at break neck speed (to me) towards "forever and ever, I love you I love you I love you" after two or three months.

this scares the shit out of me and I can't understand why someone could possibly think they love me after only knowing me for three months. Or never even having MET me yet. they love the *idea* they have of me. not the me I really am. So I tend to back up.

that doesn't mean I don't want them. I usually feel very confused at this point. I enjoy them, and I know if we keep going slowly forward I *will* fall in love with them (I don't date people with intent if I know I'm not, at some point, going to fall for them).

Unfortunately, this usually makes people's resolve stronger and they chase harder. Something about me being hesitant, confused and scared, wanting but not willing, not so quick buster, really makes most of the butches I've dated, turn up the volume.

it's like getting obsessive, or something. their feelings of limerance get amplified or something...

anyway... I'd rather



do something along those lines.

But I think, after finally dating someone who doesn't push me faster than I'm ready... who is actually going at the same pace I am... I'm really enjoying this slow ride that allows me to think, keep my space, keep my wits about me and drift along with them in a nice slow boat up a canal... rather than screaming they love me from a power boat and pelting me with roses.

WOW....can I relate to this.... glad you found someone that loves you enough to respect your pace and your choices...

Relationships should be like a fine wine...or preparing an exquisite meal.... not "microwaveable" as I have said in other posts...

[citybutch]

Well, I never thought about it like this, But I guess I went out with one of these people...I was 17 when I got with my first gf,she was 24. And at first she didnt run at all, We started a relationship, (met online) she moved for me.. She got a place, and i ended up moving in with her soon after, Anyways,

After about 7months she broke it up,and left...Then called me sayin she wanted me back,then not. Then did... off and on.. Then we didnt talk for 2months, then 2months later she called, we hung out a couple of times, and got back together...
Then 6months later, we were off again. Stopped talking for 4months, then we got back together.. That was the last time i ever took her back..Because after 5months, She broke it off again but this time leaving me for someone else.. She wanted me back amonth later which lasted a week, then didnt. After that, the next time she said she wanted me back, I said No.... And i got with my gf who i love very much..

My ex played that game with me for a 2yrs and 4months..It isnt fun...Trust me if they leave u and then want u back,then dont and on and on if they even start that....My advice to u is
RUNNN....FAST!!!!

Sounds very painful DFA... glad you have some stability now...

[BecknCallButch]

Well, I never thought about it like this, But I guess I went out with one of these people...I was 17 when I got with my first gf,she was 24. And at first she didnt run at all, We started a relationship, (met online) she moved for me.. She got a place, and i ended up moving in with her soon after, Anyways,

[size=5]

Good grief!!! Hey DarkFlaAngel1984 - Did you ever find out why the roller coaster ride? I guess that's what bugs me the most is answering the question why.

Like, why did they do this? why did they do that? You know?!? Why start a relationship if you don't want to stay and work on it. Relationships take constant daily work and some people just do not want to invest the time or energy.

In my humble opinion, if a person doesn't want to take the time to get to know one another BEFORE then you can bet they won't take the time to work things out together later. Then you are destined to fail and frankly I am so tired of trying and failing.

BecknCallButch - Determined not to fail again!

[KShawn]

I have been trying to figure out why this woman is doing all the things she has been doing against me. She and I both know that I haven't done what she accuses me of doing yet she is bound and determined to destroy my career and my life. She claims she doesn't want anything bad to happen to me then the next thing you know she's making a report against me.

I have finally come to realize it is because she truly hates me and used me all along. It's been hard for me to comprehend this but then I was fool enough to believe she really did love and want me in the first place. With believing in our relationship, I thought eventually her love for me would prevail. I really did think what we had was real and worth holding onto. Now I see it was just wishful thinking on my part. I always thought I was an optimistic thinker but I realize I am just a lovesick and stupid fool.

I now know what it is like to be hated by someone and yet I can't find it within myself to retaliate and hate her in return.

[BecknCallButch]

Is this the same thing as 'running'? Is there a thread on that? because it seems all I come across lately is femmes running, in the opposite direction.
This is one thing I can't figure out, although I know they have their own personal reasons.

I think FEAR is the one of the main reasons. Fear of getting hurt mostly. But when you establish some kind of bond with someone and they run, you kind of want to know why, what the real deal was for the running.

I'll be glad when I find a non-runner.

Push – Pull for me is the on again off again back and forth of 'I want this' verses 'This scares me'. It is also referred to as running away. I do it myself but I do not realize I'm doing it at the time. Only upon reflection or when someone brings it to my attention do I actually see that I am running.

I do it for a variety of reasons but more often than not it all boils down to feeling that I am more invested than I think they are so I start to back off. Some have accused me of being unable to make a commitment or that I'm just a heart breaker when neither is the case but those comments just drive me further away.

I get scared of being hurt again and put up my walls. It isn't that I want her to go away or leave me alone. I just want to us to slow down and not get pushed into something I am not ready to take on. I really do want to be coupled and in a loving relationship it's just that the degree of risk seems high and maybe I'm just not ready to put my heart on the line to be hurt again. I'd like to believe I won't get hurt and that the relationship will last the rest of my life - well that is my honest hope anyway.

Problem is I fall deeply in love and lose far more than I can afford to so it takes a while to recover. I like who I am so changing how I love isn't an option so my answer is to run in fear. I am afraid that one time - maybe the next time - I won't be able to recover.

Is it really so much to ask to fall in love and for that love to last a lifetime?