Depression

[FeelTheKiss]

I don't know if this is going to be a topic anyone will listen or reply to but right now I need the help.

I have posted here, on B-F in different forums, a few times but never on this subject.

I have just been released from the hospital from a voluntary admittance because I tried to take my own life a week and half ago. I have so much stress in my life right now that I thought the only way out was to make myself disappear. I realize that it was a selfish act and all the psycho drama but the feelings are returning. I have a wonderful partner who is helping me the best she can. I have a therapist who is doing the best she can but my support system seems to be failing me.

I'm not saying that I'm losing my partner or anything but I can't seem to get a grip on my sanity, if that even makes any sense. I want to cry all the time. I can't do the simplist of things without trouble. I feel like I have a gigantic emptiness inside that I can fill.

I guess my reason for posting here is to see if there was anyone out there that has been where I am now or anyone going through the same thing I am now. I have had a lot of bull in my life and I had thought I had dealt with it all very well. Up until my auto accident last year, I felt like I was on top of the world. Now I feel like I have falling down a very dark hole and I can't find that proverbale (sp) rope to pull myself out.

Anyway, I just wanted to see if there was anyone out there that I could talk to about this.

Thanks for the opportunity to post this.

[petitedrag]

yep
thought about it b4
then i started thinkin... who's gonna clean up after "the mess"

when i start feeling suicidal, i try to step outta my body, and look at others and their problems, that takes my mind of myself

sometimes it worked for me

hope you'll feel more control over yourself

*hugs*

[jelli]

Are you taking medications?

[FeelTheKiss]

Ive tried the "steeping out" approach but I just can't seem to get rid or the pain.

When I tried to take my life, i was driving my car down a road and I just turn the wheel toward a gully on the right side of the road. I didnt think about anyone else or who would have to deal with the "mess" or anything like that. All I knew was that I wanted the pain to go away and I wanted it to go away right then and there. But as I hit that gully, something made me pull the wheel back toward the left. I got back on the road, not knowing where I was going or what I was doing. I was on Valium at the time so how I didnt hurt someone else, I have no idea but I ended up at my son's job. I was very lucky that he was driving into the lot at the same time I was cuz I knew I was going to die that night.

My partner finally found me and the next day took me to my doctor who in turn immediately had me admitted.

I still have the pain, even with all this damn medication they have me on. I'm trying to deal with all but I'm finding it hard to go on day by day.

I don't want to hurt anyone. I guess thats why I'm using this site as a sounding board, to par a phrase. Thanks for listening.

[FeelTheKiss]

Yes I am on medication.....

Ready for this?????

Remeron, for depression, taken at bedtime
Effexor, for depression, taken at bedtime
Seroquel, for thought control, two at bedtime
Valium, relaxation, bedtime.......

And the list goes on and on and on.......
Does it help?????

Maybe.... I'm still alive.....

Therapy??
Doing it........

Support System??
Have a few..........

Now, with all this that I have at hand why do I still feel the way I do???

I could very easily take all these pills and end it but then I leave a "Mess" for my partner and children to "Clean up".......
Maybe thats what keeps me from doing it......I don't want to be selfish.....What a laugh....Selfish......

Sorry, a pity party was starting...........

[jelli]

who let you out and why?

[TsteTheRnBw]

What kind of comment is that Jelli??

Someone tells you they are in a deep depression - and you pop off with that????????

[FeelTheKiss]

Well, that was a reponse I was looking for..........

A comformation that I should still be in a psych ward......

I let myself out.........And because I thought I could deal with everything with my support system and medication...

I guess I was wrong........

Thanks jelli Thats just what I needed to hear

[jelli]

I was just asking ?'s not meaning to be harsh? Anyone that knows me should know that...

I was just curious if the doc's suggested she be released or if she released herself...

my apology*

but seriously I have dealt with this before as have many and if having this much trouble perhaps being away from a steadier environment isn't the key for right now...

[fireheart42]

Yes! I've been there too.
It's hard to think of someone else when the cold barrel of a gun is sounding like a good idea. I had been in the hospital for 6 months with double pneumonia, on a respirator and died twice. I lost my apartment and my stepmother got guardianship of my daughter. They all thought I wasn't gonna make it.
I put every fiber of my being into recovery after that hospital stay. This X-mas is the 3rd yr out. I still trip, but no more thoughts of ending my life.
The pain of the present will eventually pass (you'll just have to trust me here) but if you took your own life, the pain you will pass on to your son will last until the end of his life.
I know it's not easy. This is what I did: I kept a list of 10 phone numbers of people who I could call at ANY HOUR of the day/night. I took 3 pieces of paper and wrote what I loved the most 1 on each page. I made a committment to tear each piece up BEFORE I did any destructive behavior. I called friends at 3 in the a.m., hysterical with grief.
Here I am now, still a lil nuts but thats o.k.! I'm down to 40mg of prozac at night.
Overmedication was part of the problem Trazadone and Depacote made me sluggish and unmotivateded, which worsened the depression.
Asking for help is a sign you can recover.
I really hope this helps.

[jelli]

Great response Fire*

I have heard about the 3 pieces of paper before....

good job on this being #yr mark!!!!! Congrats

[FeelTheKiss]

Okay, first off, jelli, I'm sorry I flew off like I did.... I'm not very with it right now...I know in my heart what you meant but my mind saw something else.....My apologies, after all, I still may be nutty but I will always be a Lady....

Second, Fire, I have never heard of that before and I think I'm going to give it a try....I have three sons and 1 granddaughter that I love with all my heart...And I believe that with the help of my partner and the thoughts Ihave of my sons and only grandchild I will make it through....

Again, Thanks to all of you who have replied to something that is a very hard subject to attack....

I still have my issues but then everyone in the world does so if they can do it, and Fire has done it for 3 yrs, I know I can.....

Thanks(k) (k) (k)

[fireheart42]

YOU ABSOLUTELY can do it! You can have a mantra for it:"I think I can, I think I can"...o yea, that was the lil engine.... :)
Hold that lil baby in ur arms and smell his/her baby smell and feel that warm love.Leave a legacy of love not pain...
We expect an update on a regular baisis....Jelli's hearts in the right place and after you feel a lil better, you'll realize that........
Try to smile when you're in pain, can't do both (smile and cry) so u pick!
peace.

[FemmeLovinBoi]

Fire said.........

***The pain of the present will eventually pass (you'll just have to trust me here) but if you took your own life, the pain you will pass on to your son will last until the end of his life.***

Great advice. Couldn't have said it better. I have lost friends and family to suicide. Trust me when I say, even many years later, I am still affected by it.

FTK, use every resource you have, friends, family, partner, docs and here. We're all here to listen and help. And repeating what Fire said, Jelli's heart is in the right place. You'll see that if you don't already.

If you want, you can e-mail me personally and I'll always be here to listen and give you all the support I have to give.

Hang in there. "this too shall pass." (f)

[FeelTheKiss]

I had a feeling that if I came to a place where I knew I would feel some sort of comfort that I would be able to find some answers. Since I have been a member of B-F I have felt nothing but comfort. I have always posted with respect to all and to myself.

I know I am 6 feet away from that edge and it will be there for a long time but I think in time w/ all my support systems and my medication I can keep stepping back and making that edge further and further away. I'm not saying that I am healed by starting this thread.....By NO means am I saying that but what I am saying is that I know I have a home here now and I have a new "family" of supporters, if you all don't mind me saying so....

I know in time my issues will all find their proper place in my mind and I will be able to go on and deal with my day-to-day living...

I keep telling myself, "one day at a time and if not one day, then one hour or one minute" whatever works.....

But I guess what I'm trying to say is that you have all given me different avenues to look into to help myself.....I have a very long road to travel but I think I can make it......With the right tools, and the right people.....

Thanks All (k) (k) (k)

[fireheart42]

...another thought...........o the burden of a great mind.....:) Major changes affect us most on the inside......i c ur movin 2 NH.....Be gentle to yourself....
peace

[nutella]

Chronical depression is very common in the community. One thing that makes me feel sad about the community is the teen suicide rate. Not all gays make it.

Problem is, what works for one might not work for another because the causes are different. A depressed person simply can't see why they should be alive, no matter what you say.

One thing that my psychology prof told us might be of help: if you don't feel absolutely positive and confortable with your therapist, switch to another one immediately.

[fireheart42]

....and sometimes 100 people tell you something but you can only HEAR it from one......
When the student is ready, the teacher will appear...
peace.

[mia]

((((FTK)))) I am sorry to read that you are going through all of this. You said in your previous post that you haven't felt the same since your auto accident a year ago. What happened to you in that accident? How long were you in the hospital this most recent time and how long have you been on your current meds? I'm not trying to be invasive....just wanting to understand better. Regarding my own situations, I've had to be very pro-active in dealing with some of these doctors. Some are really good and some are really, really bad. Many times, they don't know if a med is going to work until you try it. If one med or combo is not working, go to something else. Since you checked yourself out of the hospital, you may not have given yourself enough time to find out if the meds were even right for you. Meds are key issues here!! You also indicate that you are moving in a few weeks, plus all the other stuff..... that's alot of stressors in your life. This too shall pass, especially once you find the right med combination to help you. Please keep posting.

p.s. have they ruled out hormonal problems as well?

[FeelTheKiss]

Hi....Its me again.....

I just wanted to answer a few of, I believe it was Mia's, questions....

My auto accident involved me and my partner in a rearend collision....We were at a dead stop and waiting to enter moving traffic when we were hit from behind....I injuried my back so badly that I couldn't feel anything down my right side for almost 2 months....MRI's showed nothing so the doctor ruled it a "soft-tissue injury" but still, here I am in a wheelchair because I can't walk, work or do anything else for myself, and I'm on all kinds of meds....For pain, depression, migraines....It was a bad time.....The woman who hit us, her insurance company didnt really pay for anything....

Anyway, I finally got a medical release from MY doctor and have been looking for work on a daily basis....But noone wants to hire anyone who has been out of work for so long a time period.....Then my granddaughter is born.....My son, her father, decides he needs to come to Ohio, where I am, from Idaho, to find work....He sponges off of me and my partner for 3 months then I told him to grow up, take care of HIS daughter and get back to her....Im told at a later date, that I will never see her because I didnt "help" him.....We, my partner and myself, because of me not working lose our apartment and are now in the basement, which is a full apartment, of her mother's......Her mother can't stand me so she needles me with snide comments about finding work.....Now, I'm already getting rejection letters and "We'll call you" statements and her mother just has to keep pushing buttons....

Anyways, My partner decided that we needed to get away from here for Thanksgivings...So we went to N.H. where we have a friend who was absolutly wonderful to us all....We fell in love with the state and the people so we decided to save my sanity by moving....Now we are two weeks away from moving, still in the basement and I'm trying to keep my sanity by staying as far away from her mother as possible...Oh, BTW, I was in the hospital a week before Thanksgivings.....Sorry, I got carried away.....

Anyway, I hope that answers some questions for you Mia....But my depresssion has been coming on since I was a child....Too many things, too losses, too much hurt.....Too much to go into here...Just wanted to give you some ideas.....I will try to keep posting...

Fire, I am working on those three things.....Just wanted you to know... :)

Thanks All (k) (k) (k)

[fireheart42]

< FTK> just wanted to tell ya good morning &you're in my prayers . Hey! don't laugh! positive energy out = positive energy back(})

[mia]

FTK, Thanks for clarifying. You've had alot to deal with for some time now. Are these new meds for you? If so then they have not had enough time to work effectively ....hang in there. My son is on seroquel and that is suppose to help control mania. I was surprised when you said that you were on it, then I read up more about it. I did see where it is prescribed for some forms of depression.

It sounds like others have some pretty good insight and advise. We are here for you. My email is available if you would like to correspond.

[FeelTheKiss]

Thanks Mia, I really appreciate all the suggestions and advice that I am getting here...

Yes, this is just one of the new meds that I was put on while I was in the hospital.... I am starting to feel a little beeter as each day goes by..

I made a MAJOR step last night..... I told my partner's mother how I felt and how she made me feel and as my partner has always told she, she denied everything but I felt better for coming out and telling her how she was making me feel... So one more step forward for me....

The move is really helping also.... With trying to get everything packed and into storage it has helped to keep me busy.....
I'm taking one day at a time and confronting one thing at a time so I am on my way :)

I'll keep posting as long as possible before we have to pack up the puter but then it will be a few days after that and I'll be back...

I am in the mind set now that I DO have reasons for staying healthy, mind, body and soul....All of you have been terrific toward me and you really don't know how much that means to me...

I'll check in again later :k :k :k
(k) (k)

[FeelTheKiss]

Well, I see that noone has said anything for a bit in here but I just wanted to give an update.

As of December 24th, my partner and I and our son will be on our way to our new home in New Hampshire. I am still under a doctor's care and still having my good and bad days but I'm dealing with things one step at a time.

I just wanted to thank all that contributed to my thread and all the advice and well-wishes. I hope that you all have a wonderful holiday and I will talk to you all again, soon.

Later All,
Tae(k) (k) (k)

[GG]

It was about seven years ago that I sank into a deep depression. I think my childhood finally caught up with me and the hard attempts to be perfect failed. I could not see any daylight. All I seen was darkness. Deep drab darkness. I didn't want to get out of bed or do anything else. I felt as if I were such a failure. Finally I went to the doctor because I knew I needed help and I knew my children needed me.

Eventually I was put on Paxil. Well, long story short, the Paxil worked. It turned out I had a chemical imbalance.

I then changed some things in my life. I stayed away from people who were always negative, tried to think more positive about things, made smaller--more short term goals, found things to keep my interest and keep my mind busy, so I didn't think about bad things too much and learned to just say "fuck it." We can't fix everything and can't make everything better.

Someone told me once, "When you are a child you are not responsible for what happens to you, but there comes a day when you grow up and become an adult. It is this time that you are the only one that can decide how the past will affect you. You can choose to let it affect you in a bad way or you can learn to grow past it and leave it." Well, that statement helped me a great deal.

FeelTheKiss, please find the vision within yourself to see the ability of your own greatness. Everyone has a greatness. Not everyone has to make a large, spotlight greatness, for it is the small greatnesses that make wonderful differences in the world, too.

Maybe it will help to start a journal and write you feelings down. Maybe it will help to draw or paint or some other release. No one can judge this release. It is all your own.

Take care and find your own strength. Build it little by little and it will get stronger. Keep reaching out until you find just the right person to talk to. Stay away from negative influences.

Sincerely,

GG

[mia]

(((FTK))) It's good to hear that you are having some good days! That's a start. Hang in there. Let us know how you are doing.

[shabadoo]

This is very very hard to reveal here on the forum. I too, like some others, had an insane childhood. My depression was imbedded from the start (actually, both sides of my family has a history of severe depression, and my mother and father both suffered from different versions).

During those years (until I was 21), I tried to take my life a number of times, but something kept me hanging on. I remember thinking "If I just hang in here, until I get out and away, I will be free of this all someday, free from depression."

It didn't work out that way, and I have spent the past 20 years, in bit and pieces, to different degrees, working on/with this. I have been "taken to the edge of the abyss" a good number of times, but at least never got as far as collecting what I needed to take my life with.

(BTW, I don't necessarily believe in suicide as an evil - it's complicated, and I'm not advocating it per se, but in different ways, including spiritual, I believe it has it's place. For instance, is one life so valuable, just for the mere sake of it's existence, even if the person suffers endlessly, that it must, no matter what, continue? Please, before anyone freaks out - think for instance about the option of suicide for the elderly or severely ill - there are mixed perspectives there.)

In addition to depression, I've had various, more minor health issues at different points along the way, mostly extreme fatigue, and digestive distress. 8 years ago I was seriously injured, the result of a number of things, and have been diagnosed with some "permanent" disabilities. At any rate, daily pain and over 50% loss of abilities became the "norm".

I have had dear friends over the years, dear therapists, a hospital stay, medications, support groups, sobriety, dietary changes, writing, talking, holding on to whatever was there to hold on to, deep spiritual work, etc., right up to this very moment.

And I can count on 2 hands the moments in some days when I have felt good, well, happy, at peace. I remember 1 night when I woke from sleep feeling like I had what should have been a normal, "good night's sleep". I can count on those same 2 hands the moments when I felt "okay", and felt like it was great to be alive, a joy to be here. Those moments passed pretty quickly and it was like going off the edge of a great height - I could literally feel every part of my being dropping like lead from that height.

I don't really lay it down, to the bone, like this anymore, except with a therapist. I've found that friends/family just repeat things they've told me too many times, and/or get angry, frustrated, scared, blank. So I carry this with me, struggling with each and every day, mostly internally, to just keep on - because that's what I'm "supposed" to do, because that's the most I feel capable of doing. And I too think of how much pain I would cause others if I commited suicide (in spite of how much pain I myself live with, carry, suffer with day-to-day).

Don't get me wrong, I am persistent, strong-willed. I have railed and ranted against the "forces of darkness", and I have surrendered to "blind faith". I know I've had it better than so many others in this world, and I do experience gratitude for so very much. Loving my siblings as a child, and being loved by others as an adult, knowing love, has saved my ass.

But ... here I am, in pain - emotional, mental, physical and spiritual - about ... ? 75% of each day? the other 25% by no means free, easy - but aided by the medications, distractions by way of vicarious experiences of others' lives, and dropping into as much sleep as I can get.

And I honestly don't know why, don't get it, with all the resources inside and outside of me. Even if I or someone could say "Oh, it's all a chemical imbalance" or "Oh, it's genetic" or "Oh, it's your spiritual lesson" - I've approached it from all of those angles all along - I no longer care to know "why", because I don't think it matters any more if I know the answer to that or not. What matters is "how" to free myself from some of this kind of suffering, not just for a moment, but enough to ... ? thrive? manage better than I have all this time? be able to offer something of greater value to others before I go? just feel relief for goodness sake?!

I expect that some reading this might roll their eyes, mumble about "drama queens", say I haven't tried the "right" meds or therapists, or need to "get out more", or take up a hobby, or volunteer with the less fortunate (all of which I have done, often still do).

Actually, I think alot of people who know me, even some who are close, would have no idea that this is the bulk of my experience every day. I think I'm perceived by most as - although moody, and struggling daily with many different problems - having "gumption", humor, nerve, wit, strength, a limitless heart, having "so much going for" me.

I'm afraid of "So what are you telling us for Ms. There's No Way Out?"

I'm not sure why I'm writing this here. Maybe just to say that this is a reality I live with, since I can't say that to others close to me any more?

Whomp, there it is ...

[Champagne]

And I can so much relate to what you are saying, Shabadoo. I wonder, are you in therapy? I have been for several years now and I do notice a very slow improvement. It's agonizingly slow but it does seem now that I have a little more perspective when the old suicidal urges hit.

Actually right now is a really bad time for me because of a recent breakup (lots of abandonment stuff getting triggered there, and not to mention it's the freakin' holidays).

Just wanted to say to you and FTK that I know what you're talking about and you are not alone in those feelings. Big hugs to all of us and to the others who understand. (like you, Fireheart)

[InsatiableFemme]

I have to agree.. having depression is a battle.. i fight it every day.. i was diagnosed with a chemical imbalance, and was in therapy for over a year to simply learn how to cope with it. I had a pretty shitty childhood with a mother who battled depression, so I didnt get the attention I needed... but I am an adult now, and I control myself... and not let the disease control me! Mind you I have really shitty days..and good days as well.. but I am learning to control how I respond to things, and acknowledge that its okay just to be me.... ~ ~ fight the fight ~ ~ is my attitude..and enjoy the good days..*just gotta be me* hugs to all and hang in there.. IF

[shabadoo]

Champagne,

thanks for just validating this kind of experience of depression. It's always helpful, especially when nothing else seems to be.

When loved ones sometimes have asked me "Well, what can I do?" (after giving me all the advice in the world, none of which is news to me!) I find myself saying: "Just tell me you understand, that you're sorry I'm in so much pain, and that everything's gonna be alright."

At times, the validation and acceptance is enough of a comfort to get me through another day ...

BTW, yes I'm in therapy - have been on/off over the years. This time it's with an extremely wonderful woman, very evolved, right to the core, we "get" each other, sometimes with very little words! I feel so lucky to have found her, and will continue as long as I can (I'm on SSDI, and have to pay her out of pocket - and my pockets have great big holes in them, so to speak!)

I'm sorry for the stress of your breakup, especially at this provoking time of year! My heart goes out to you. (u) (l)
_____________________________________

Oh, and does anyone else ever get that totally lost feeling in terms of "Why am I like this? What is the problem? Am I going to be like this my whole life?"

I know I said before that I don't care about the why's anymore, but sometimes knowing what the cause is for something can help determine what to do about it! As I said, I've been through the wringer with every possibility - genetic, chemical, my childhood, situational, blahblahblah, to no avail.

I've even gone into very scary speculations about my spirit/soul/karma etc. (i.e. I was "meant" to carry suffering for other people - I'm being karmically punished for being evil in another life - I just came into this life a fucked-up person/ality, so what can I expect?" That kind of dangerous crap!)

So I feel, sometimes with great fear, sometimes great rage, like I don't know "What the hell is wrong with me anyway?!" And feel helpless to "Get over it already will ya?!" (as I have heard, frequently, from others, and imagine is unspoken by the rest of the world!)

[Janet]

FTK,
I was wondering a bit about your meds...
You did say the two anti-deppressants, the Seroquel and Valium. You also mentioned pain-killers due to a very severe and painful injury.
I may have misread, but are you still on the pain meds?

The reason for my question is this: I'm also on an anti-depressant and Seroquel. I have FMS and was taken completely off all pain meds, something I am not completely happy with, but for a good reason.
Both the Valium and most pain meds act as depressants. Someone who is already clinically depressed maybe should not be taking those type of meds.
The anti-depressants may just be working against the Valium, etc, and bringing you back to where you were already.
This is what I was told my my dr. It has made a world of difference for me as far as my mental outlook. I didn't have Valium, but Klonopin, a related drug.

Depression is an awful place to be and to feel.
We all know this. FTK, I wish you all the best in NH.
Janet

[InsatiableFemme]

Oh, and does anyone else ever get that totally lost feeling in terms of "Why am I like this? What is the problem? Am I going to be like this my whole life?"

I agree with you, i wonder if I was a letch in my last lifetime.. or is this a burden I committed to on this journey.. to further myself.. whatever it is.. well.. I sure have learned from it..but it sucks! I am lucky.. compared to some, I am not heavily medicated, though I was misdiagnosed by a total Quack pyschiatrist in my teens, who diagnosed me as a bi-polar, and I was stoned to the hilt on meds that made me seriously ill.. he has since had his licensce revoked. I am on 200 mg of Zoloft, but thinking I made need to change it, been on it for 4 years now.. and it doesn't work as well, though.. it is sure better then going totally without!

I know this is the time of year that is rough for many... try to keep positive..and keep the drama on the back burner... I am thankful my folks are many miles away.. take care of you!! Sending warm thoughts to all.. hugs IF (l) (l) (l) (l) (l) (l)

[FeelTheKiss]

Hi All...

Its been a few days since I've posted but I received some responses in my email that I wanted to address....

Yes, I am on painkillers but have almost quit taking them because I have found other ways of dealing with my pain.... I wanted to let you all know that the reason for the painkillers is NOT because of the accident.... I was in a very abusive relationship way back when and when I went to leave her (as told to me by someone else, as I have no recollections) she grabbed me and stripped me down and tied to to what was at one time our bed... I was raped repeatedly and beaten. I was then turned over and stabbed in my back...My oldest son found me and Thanks to him I am here today.... I will always have the pain in my back as there is nothing more that can be done. The accident just aggravated the old injury.... Thats the reason for the painkillers, at that time.... Very rarely do I take them now.... I am also on Effexor and Remeron as well as the Valium...

As you all know, My partner and I are moving within the next 5 days and its going to be a very hectic time for us both but its a move that needs to be made.... I'm trying to keep myself busy with moving and making sure everything is taken care of...eg..Drs records, school records, custody papers, vets records, blood tests on the dog, (she has a liver problem), etc etc.... Its helping me in a way to think of the future now and it lifts a little weight off my shoulders....

I have been in therapy and out for years when I was young for sexual abuse from my father....My mother died almost 3 years ago and I'm still trying to deal with that, I didnt attend her funeral due to a rather "strong" relationship I was in at the time...I was unable to say my goodbyes to her and I feel guilt for that everyday I am on this earth... I have since come back to Ohio, where she is buried and have gone to her grave numerous times but its not the same.... I am trying to deal with it but not too well....

I have written letters to people that I know will never receive them and that has helped me in getting some of the anger and hatred out... I was never a person to dwell on my past...I just put it way in the back of my mind and left it there....I hate when people feel sorry for you when they hear the horror stories you've lived through....Anyways, this is just a little bit more into the mind of FTK....LOL....

I won't be able to get online until we are settled in New Hampshire but as soon as we do, I will let you all know whats going on....Thanks for the hugs, I do need them....

Thanks(k) (k) (k)

[InsatiableFemme]

Hang in there FTK, it does get better... finally someone else speaking out against rape from another woman... wow..thanks for talking about that.. I was drugged (rohypnol) and brutally raped by a woman, and have permanent damage.. I have no recollection of the event <thank god!> but still have physical damage... my attitude now is.. no matter how crappy you feel.. tommorow will get better HUGS FTK.. it will get better.. IF

[FeelTheKiss]

And to think, I thought I was the only one who had ever been raped by another woman... Like I said before, I dont remember a think and maybe thats a good thing but then again maybe if I could have some memory of it I could deal with the whole issue differently.... I don't know but I'm glad I'm not the only one.... Hugs to you hun....

(k) (k) (k)

[mia]

(((shabadoo))) wow, your post is heart-wrenching to say the least. It brought back alot of memories of where I have been during my life. I know that you said you are tired of hearing people giving you advise, but I'm got to give it to you.... just have to, especially since you posted here :) There is help out there. Since there is a strong history of depression in your family, your problem sounds like it may be more chemical in nature. There are way too many meds out there to give up trying and it sounds like what you are on is only working half-ass.... if that at all. I'm certainly not a doctor, but I've become pretty well versed in alot of these drugs. Lots of new meds out there. If one is not working, try another and then another and then another.... start with combinations if you have to. It's a hit and miss in trying to find the right medications sometimes. Everyone is different. Another thing to keep in mind is that many times family members share similar brain chemistries. Meds that work for one family member many times work for the other.... and visa versa.

Please email me if you'd like to go private. I want you to know that we are here for you and that you are not alone. ok?

[mia]

(((((((((FeelTheKiss, InsatiableFemme, Janet my lil sis, shabadoo, Champagne, GG & petitedrag ))))))))


just wanted to give you all a big hug and wish you peace this holiday season. Be kind & gentle with yourselves. Janet, it was good to see you post again. I was wondering where you went to. FTK, please keep us posted on what's up with you. You are all in my heart and I'm thankful that we are able to share in this forum.

peace and goodwill,

[shabadoo]

Reading your profile, you sure seem to live up to your self-description: "I am a sensitive soul who tries to treats others with kindness and respect... "

Thank you for that - I am always SO awed, moved, grateful for people of this ilk! It's really one of my "pet peeves" (not so minor though!) that it seems these qualities are a rarity in the human species.

I used to be very misanthropic, most of my life, because of things like that. Didn't recognize it until I started to address it in my late 30's. Now I have much more balanced perspective, and only fall into that by way of extreme examples (which now just as often have me feeling disappointed, grieved, or compassionate - not just angry/"hateful"/scared).

Speaking to the meds issue, I have been doing the rounds for the past 10+ years. Some didn't work at all, some had side effects that were intolerable, and some worked for periods of time then seemed to change. It's a little tricky because I'm also on meds for a physical disability.

But recently I found a new doc who I'm really happy with. She's totally into treating patients as peers, real people. And she's absolutely thrilled to have me coming to her with my own ideas, willingness to question, and be patient with the time it takes to find the right combos. We've got a new one going right now that does seem very promising! So you're advice is taken as validation :)

A continued thank you to everyone for being brave and generous in speaking openly about yourselves, and to others!

I found a holiday card I couldn't resist (swore I was forgoing that this year!):

"In the silence of winter, may we hear and understand the quiet inner voice of the spirit. Wishing you all that is calm, all that is beautiful."

Blessings, peace.

[shabadoo]

I wanted to re-read my original post, as it was written in the midst of a serious low. It doesn't seem to be there anymore!

Does anyone know why this might have happened?

Thanks.

[InsatiableFemme]

Unfortunately..when we have lows..the world seems to close in..the hardest thing is trying to keep everything in perspective. Hang in there.. it's best to talk/write when this happens.. and don't analyze when it does happen. Hugs to all..and peace!

(l) (l) (l) IF

[PandoraStarz]

GG I read that you were on Paxil.
I'm thinking about trying it since
nothing really working for me.
Did you suffer any side affects good or bad?

[GG]

PandoraStarz,
That was so many years ago, but the two things I can remember for sure was the lack of interest in sex and the monotone feeling of emotions. At that time those things weren't bad because before Paxil I had no interest in life itself. Everyone is different and medications affect everyone differently.

Best of luck to you.

GG

[PandoraStarz]

Ok thanks GG I kinda feel like that
now so I can relate.I think I'm going
to try Paxil though.Thanks

[shabadoo]

Not resolution, but revelation.

A very traumatic "thing" happened for me last night. No details, it was somewhat situational, but mostly internal. I had a PTSD breakdown that overlayed onto the recent past and immediate present.

Jumping ahead, it was a horrible night. And this morning, in the midst of my bone-weariness, my numbness and disconnection, I had the revelation that my depression is a mental illness.

Ok, some of you go ahead and say "duh, yeah!?"

I have lived with depression all of my life. I have recognized and dealt with it through various means for 30 years (see my long initial post above for details). But I never "got it", understood it to be an illness until this morning.

Don't ask me why this suddenly came through. I've had PTSD episodes before. I've had breakdowns and horrible nights. Even the details of what I experienced were not really new to me.

But this morning it just dawned on me (pun intended).

I'm still in shock about this. I never thought of some types of, some people's depressions as illness. And put this together with my 8 year old physical disability, all the interplays there, wow ...

(I once thought of a title to a great book I'll likely never write: Depression and Disability: Double Whammy. Don't anyone steal that now, you just never know, I just might write it someday! ;) )

That's all I can write at the moment. Thanks to whoever reads this and nods their heads, mumbles an "uh-huh", feels a twinge of recognition and compassion - and thanks to those who write here on this very tender thread ... I like to believe that those nods and mumbles have at least some kind of cosmic, meta-physical, mystic and physics-related effect for the better through the particles of energy that connect us all ...

Best,
Shaba

[PandoraStarz]

Your not alone shabadoo its the Fucking Hoildays.
A depressed persons worst nightmare.
I to got really depressed last night.
Holidays will do that to you.
Its not rare for most depressed people
to get hit the hardest around the Holidays.
I really don't know what to say but
that its one shitty day. Atleast you'll be free
until Valentines day rolls around ,and becomes
Kryptonite to our species.:)

[youngblood]

A technique I know and use quite often Is something called a Soul Retrieval. A ritual practiced by shamans from age old times to present. Sandra Has written two great books on the subject.

I have noticed that with this kind of work, results can be quick to slow. But the idea is that at some point in our lifes, some of us go thru a soul fragmentation. A shaman can bring back the missing piece. Someone could of stolen a part of the soul ,a rape or accident, anything can trigger soul loss. Anything. and it does not happen to everyone for the same reasons.

As crazy as it sounds, this does work.
I have a question, Do you crave sweet stuff? Check out The body ecology diet by donna gates. great test for an hidden problem.

[Truesbabygirl]

Just thought I'd post a little something in here... I have struggled with depression my entire life... I'm 25 and started having suicidel thoughts when I was 12. I was born with certain disadvantages which didn't allow me to function as a normal child. I was in and out of hospitals from the time I was born till Iwas in my teens.

I have always been a "dark" or 'sad" soul. Even when I'm happy. A little over a year ago I took 35 tylenol PM's and laid down to die. Had True not come home I probably would have. I was in the hospital in intensive care for what seemed like months after that. I played off the overdose and lied about how many pills I took. They never knew I was trying to kill myself. After that I felt so guilty for making True and my family worry that I just sort of tucked it away and became 'happy" Mindy. But in the last few months the depression has set back in and can completely over come me in a matter of seconds. It is taking its tool on my relationship with True. He doesn't understand how some one can struggle with depression but act ok or happy or funny or "normal" at the same time. I guess his view of depression is one that most have, depressed people wear black all the time don't bathe don't smile don't get out of bed. Granted those things are all hard to do some days but I force myself to function daily so that our relationship doesn't suffer. I have found an all natural anti depressent that I'm gonna start taking soon. This will be my first attempt at taking anything for my depression. I have always just kept it inside and dealt with it myself. Anyways I just felt like getting that out. I don't really talk about much at home. I can't. Thanks for starting this thread. ((((((everyone)))))

~mindy~

[shabadoo]

He doesn't understand how some one can struggle with depression but act ok or happy or funny or "normal" at the same time. I guess his view of depression is one that most have, depressed people wear black all the time don't bathe don't smile don't get out of bed. Granted those things are all hard to do some days but I force myself to function daily so that our relationship doesn't suffer.

i agree with you on that, so true. i always have people in my life disbelieving me when i try to tell them how i struggle with so much darkness every day! they've always seen the kooky, entertaining, lively, persevering, well-put-together part of me. (and this includes my disability too: "you don't look like you have a disability, like you're in pain.")

i used to act way differently in terms of playing up the wearing black etc. thing, so that people could and would see and acknowledge my state of being. but that's a trap, because it didn't help me with depression at all, to say the least - but made it worse.

now i find myself asking close loved ones things like "do you really understand and believe me when i explain my daily physical and mental health struggles to you?"

as they say "don't judge a book by it's cover"!

[Janet]

((((((((everyone)))))))
Hope everyone weathered the holidays, made it through somehow. Shabadoo, you have it exactly, the holidays are the worst possible times of the year, at least for me, and it seems to be for most everyone else I know in similar head spaces.

Shabadoo, wow, everything clicked. It really is an illness. If friends and family don't/can't understand it's only that they have never been there thenselves. Quite a revelation, and I'm wondering if you are more at peace with yourself, and gentler with yourself now. You seem to be, and that is wonderful.

Mindy, you have to do those things, getting up and smiling when you don't want to, and it's called living. Going through the motions, what ever you want to call it. I hope that this anti-depressant works, and that you find peace.

I hope al of us find peace.

Mia, always, thank you
~janet

[MadHatter]

Hey folks!
Just wanted to let people here know that I've created another discussion for those of us who are diagnosed with Major Depression, Recurrent and have received long term treatment.

My hope is to create a place free from the usual preliminary "qualifying" and "have you tried this?" questions.
A useful database of information based on actual experience.
A forum where those of us in long term treatment can bitch, moan, vent and say "unhealthy" things if we want to ;)
Perhaps also to "give a clue" to people who offer us unsolicited advice as to who it is they're talking to anyway.

I hope some of you will contribute.

[youngblood]

On a very personal note, My soul Retrieval helped alot. And also explained where some of the depression came from. My experiance counts.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[mia]

(((Mindy))) are you going to try st.johnswort? there is also another product called samE, which is suppose to be good. I'm sorry to hear that you are struggling with this.

[mia]

Originally posted by youngblood
On a very personal note, My soul Retrieval helped alot. And also explained where some of the depression came from. My experiance counts.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

YB, I would be interested in hearing more about this and how it has helped you.

[mia]

Most of our lives we've been taught to believe that the darker side of human nature is bad. Something that we have to try and fix somehow.... through therapy or drugs. I've been thinking about this alot over the past couple of years, especially in dealing with my own morbid thoughts and depression.

In alot of ways, I've come to appreciate the darker side of human nature and all the beauty that lies hidden underneath it all. The fear, the innocence of simple sadness & morbidity. I'm not referring to the life threatening forms of depressive madness, though that has it's place somewhere in life. I'm referring simply to the quiet darkness that so many of us feel sometimes.... ok, most of the time for some of us. Why isn't it just ok to be a little morbid? Are we more unsettled because of trying to fit in with a society which condems such pattern of thoughts?

Darkness has it's own beauty.

Just my thoughts....

[Truesbabygirl]

Mia actually I'm going to try something called "Serenity". I have never tried "St. Johns Wart" Perpahs I'll try that next. My depression is taking its tole on my relationship with True so I"d try just about anything right now.

I think most of all I just want peace. Not that my life is in any way crazy or fast paced or hectic.... I lost my father when I was 13 and have managed to keep all my thoughts hurts and feelings about his death inside. I'm not one to talk about deep stuff. My best friend is constantly begging me to "open up" and I just can't. Seems the forums allow me to atleast talk about my problems. And I am glad for that. ((((((everyone))))) Have a good Monday. ~mindy~

[mia]

(((Mindy))) if your depression is having this much of an effect on you and you are wanting out, please go see a doctor. I'm a herb nut myself, but have learned over the course of time that they do not help as much as medication. I have st. john's wort growing in my garden. Everyone is differen't and I'm only speaking from my own experience. I've been on a number of medications, but my current one, effexor is the best.

I can relate about not wanting to talk about what's going on deep inside of you. When I'm in a bad way, I don't.... period. That's the problem. It's easier to talk and write about it when I'm in a better place. Kind of like referring to someone else in the third person. I'm not very good at reaching out to people. It's a trust thing with me. When it gets really bad, the best thing for me to do is leave and retreat in nature. That's always a source of healing to me.

Please email me if you'd like to go private Mindy. Hugs to you all.

[FeelTheKiss]

Hi All,

Just a little update. We finally made the move and have been here for a little shy of 3 weeks. Its been a very trying time for us but so far we're hanging in there. I'm still on the meds and I am looking for a new doctor up here that I can trust as much as my last.

I'm working through the red tape of SSI and hoping that we will know something soon. I'm also trying to get a new job, working in the town hall here in Bristol.

I want to welcome the new posts and thank them all for their input on this thread. What started out as a sounding board for myself has turned into a thread that everyone is finding useful, I hope. I'll keep in touch as much as possible. Thank again all

Tae(k) (k) (k)

[beachlovengirl]

I realize this is a very "sensitive" (to say the least) topic. One should be carefull about their comments. I have a wealth of information for you on this subject, from my own experience, but I don't want to air it out here. If you would like to chat, message me, and we'll get on messenger.

Beachlovengirl:P

[mia]

((((FTK)))) welcome back!! It sounds like you are doing much better. Say it's so.... or not is ok too :) Anyways, glad to see you back. Look forward to hearing from you.

[chnacat]

as a person who has battled serious clinical depression as well as an eating disorder for most of my life (35 years)...i thought i'd add my couple of cents.

clinical depression IS a mental illness...some people are predisposed to it, and some people aren't.

i know for me, when i realized that i was actually sick, and it wasn't my "fault" for feeling so sad all of the time, it made it easier to deal with and to treat. like other illnesses, it's a manageable disease. i've taken prozac for 13 years (and yes, i've tried going off of it, to disasterous consequences)...i have come to the understanding that my brain doesn't make and/or process seratonin properly....and i need a little pharmeceutical help...probably always will.

the one thing about prozac is that it sort of flattens you out...no extreme highs, and no extreme lows...and there are sexual side affects (lowered libido)....but i'll tell ya, i'd rather be a little flat emotionally, than dead, cause if i wasn't taking it, i'd most assuredly have killed myself by now....

so i'm grateful to be here. i still have minor depressive episodes, but they pass...and i'm able to experience joy and love and life!

[Janet]

FTK, I'm really glad you are doing good!
Mindy, I hope you are doing good too.
I hope everyone is!

[LadyHawk280]

I've battled with depression since I was 12, when I suffered my first major depression and I spent most of my 36 years in it to some degree or another...

Paxil has been my saving grace in this battle...it has worked wonders for my outlook on life and feelings of peace in my own mind and body...I didn't think I'd ever have that...peace...no pain...just peace...it was such a wonderous experience when I realized the pain had finally gone away...it comes back now and again but not for long and not usually as deep...

I was terribly resistant to medications and the thought that I couldn't control my own mind...I thought it was a character flaw of some kind...now, I can't really imagine what I was thinking...I'm sure I will be taking Paxil or something like it for the rest of my life...but I'm ok with that now...

I agree with those of you that say it's an illness although I prefer the term "disorder" in that our brains aren't functioning properly and they need a bit of help to balance them...it's nothing to be ashamed of...

I also would like to hear more about the soul retrieval work youngblood...

Best wishes to all, LadyHawk

[mia]

what a hard idea to accept... mental illness. I fight it all the time. A few weeks ago I was listening to my doctor talking to the receptionist handling my paperwork. They kept using the word SMI in terms of my co-pay. I asked them what SMI stood for and they told me Serious Mental Illness.

I can't describe the terrible feeling I had at that moment. I told the lady, "but I'm not crazy!" It makes me tearful just writing this.

What a horrible stigma.

[funnyfox]

Mia I know what you mean.
Even though mental illness has become increasingly talked about in the media lots of the public and family members act like a person diagnosed with a psychological illness is either some kind of freak or contagious. This sadly extends to the gay community as well even though for many years and even today many consider being gay a mental illness!! You would think gay folk would be a little more understanding but I guess that's not the case.

Heck I never been able to meet any womyn that I could be honest with about my own problems. The last womyn I was with spoke about this grrl she dated and broke it off with because the grrl confessed to her she was bipolar. After hearing that I certainly wasn't going to come clean so to speak. (I OCD and depression)

Anyway I just rejoined the forum and wanted to put my 02 in. Thanks everyone and good luck to all of us.

ff

[petitedrag]

but i gotta handle my business myself
gonna go out to do my favorite sport and sweat it all out

inside a healthy body there's a healthy mind

[LadyHawk280]

Mia: I've read many of your posts and feel that I've come to know you a bit...and you are definately not crazy!! Makes me angry...we have enough to deal with without the stigma - especially from people that should be much more sensitive than that.

FunnyFox: There are womyn who will be accepting of your issues...I told my boi about my bi-polar disorder (although I have always tended to be much more depressive than manic) during our second phone conversation as I wanted her to run fast if it was a deal-breaker...iI didn't want to waste time with someone that couldn't handle it or wasn't willing to try...

So, keep up your spirits, there are plenty of wonderful womyn out there...

Best wishes to all, LadyHawk

[Gracious Li]

My dear sweet sister in petiteness (f)

inside a healthy body there's a healthy mind

Unfortunately, my body is not as healthy as it could/should be, but I do hope that hasn't affected my mind!

Re: the Insecurities thread ... Well, I'm here in the Depression thread because I need to acknowledge that I just hit a wall with the former. I shorted-out. I still need to respond to one post, out of respect and on principle. But I'm not very encouraged about my ability to do so right now. Honestly, I have never felt this kind of ... saturation set in with the forum. I don't seem to be able to take any more in, let alone put any more out ... ?

So today I got triggered all over creation, hypersensitive, starting with trying to engage in the thread but not being able to, and weaving in issues about: my loss of all of my best friendships, the lack of new ones coming in; communication and connections via the impersonal machine in front of me; feeling like I've always had to fight, struggle to explain myself, to attain understanding; feeling like I've alienated people and they're out there in the world thinking I'm a controlling, mean ol' bitch (or some such); feeling very very alone (not to mention lonely ... )

This triggering also manifested through a phone call with my sweetheart, innocent at first, and then because of one simple situation mentioned - kapow! I ended up so RAW, in a FURY (not like me), and SOOOO HURT, so fragile ...

This isn't just "I had a rough day today". These are ongoing struggles. Sometimes I wish I could keep my mouth shut, my thoughts and feelings to myself, and just be a supportive witness to everyone else. (I've been told I get too verbose, too analytical, too precise, intense, affected, reactive, provoking, etc. etc.)

I feel sad, discouraged, exhausted, disliked, disconnected ...

Goodnight all.

[LadyHawk280]

Thanks Gracious for sharing your feelings...

You articulated things that I've felt often and never had words for...

Wish I had a dollar for every time I've been called overly sensitive...

And your words connected with me so I hope that helps you not feel so alone...

[funnyfox]

LadyHawk,

Thank you for your words of encouragement.

ff

[Juliedog]

This is a hard place for me to post to I think. I have struggled with depression since early childhood, but I realize it is something I have been fairly closeted about. I have had over ten years of therapy, and ten years of prozac, so I think it is safe to say my depression is chemical in nature. Yet, even with the emotional leveling of the prozac, I still have some down days. And I was recognizing a tendency within myself to want to hide away when I perhaps need to talk or be around people the most. I am having one of those down moments right now as I write, so this is a big step for me.

One other thing I wanted to ad from my personal history is that I was in an abusive relationship for eight years, and that was a particularly rough situation to extract myself from. My femme was abusing me, and I was physically bigger, stronger and of course, butch. There was so much shame attached to this issue, and particularly at the time in history that it occurred [late 70s-80s], lesbians and gays did not acknowledge the existence of such situations. This relationship led to me developing PTSD which seem to have mostly recovered from at this point in time.

Anyhow, thanks for letting me 'come out' a little tonight.

[LadyHawk280]

It's a very big step to share such intimate details of your life and to reach out when you'd rather hide...but know that you are safe here...

Please feel free to email me anytime you feel you need some extra support (or just cause you want to)...

Take care...LadyHawk

[mslisabell]

First I want to say that y'all are wonderful and posting may be hard, but to be able to feel better just by talking is wonderful. I've suffered from bi polar disorder forever (and I'm almost 40 now). It's taken many psychchologists, therapists and drug mixes to find a space where I can feel ok about most things. For those who do not feel "right" or in a good space, I will tell you strait away, to find help. Depression is not something one can fight alone. I am currently on Effexor, Tegretol, Serequel and Klonopin. The mix is wonderful. I can wake up feeling refreshed in the morning, and sleep like a baby. I don't cry all day long, and I am relatively functional. I do see a therapist that I really like every week, and a pdoc every month for med checks. Anyway, I just wanted to say that I too, know how y'all feel. If anyone wants to chat, needs a shoulder or just wants to shoot the bull, please send me a note...

Take care,
Lisa

[mia]

LadyHawk, you are a sweetie. I'm feeling better, ty. Bipolar and Major Depression are considered serious mental illnesses in the insurance industry. The stigma is heartwrenching. Rarely do I talk about my illness to others. Sometimes I question why I'm even posting about this in the forum. Over the past year (due to my son's bipolar illness) I've become a little more open about my illness.... most people though, have no idea that I suffer from depression. I have a wonderful employer who has been very supportive of my battle with my son's bipolar. I'm afraid and hesitant to say anything to her about my own issues for fear that she might think less of me and my job performance. Sometimes people can't help but feel akward.

Interestingly, I heard today on the radio that there is a very high percentage rate of people suffering from a depressive disorder who go undiagnosed and untreated. I believe that at least one of the anti-depressants is in the top 10 of prescribed drugs;probably prozac. We can't be that alone in the world.

On another note, my son has been improving dramatically since his med changes last week. His psychiatrist added an anti-depressant called lexapro. I'm sure it's too early to tell, plus there were a few other changes to his meds. This is the best that he's been (consistently) since last summer. The clouds are clearing away. His teacher said that he has started to get back his joking and teasing ways. He's even joking with mom, though it's been gradual. That's one thing that he hasn't done since this acute episode started. It's the little things that are coming back. They all add up to make a big difference.

Thank you LadyHawk for your kindness.

[mia]

Originally posted by petitedrag
but i gotta handle my business myself
gonna go out to do my favorite sport and sweat it all out

inside a healthy body there's a healthy mind

petitedrag, exercise does help to a degree.... my therapist keeps telling me that anyways. Many forms of depression however are biological/chemical in nature. I wish it were that easy to cure.

[mia]

mslisabell, glad you stopped by! you used the word pdoc. are you on a bipolar email list? (Pdoc stands for psychiatrist, for those who may be wondering.) There is a bipolar thread in this forum too.

[Juliedog]

Just gotta add my two cent to the exercise and depression thingy. When I was younger, I used to run a lot, in my pre-prozac days. I sometimes ran 10Ks even. But what would happen is I would cycle through my ups and downs, and on the down days I could barely move, regardless of the fact that on 'better' days I could easily run six miles. For some of us, depression is definitely chemically based. Now that I am taking meds, if I get out and exercise, I feel better overall than if I become a permanent couch potato, but for some of us exercise alone will never be an overall solution.

[LadyHawk280]

I'm so glad to hear that your son is doing so much better!! That's really wonderful news...

I may have to email you at some point about your experiences...my niece is having some trouble and I could probably benefit from your knowledge to help my sister out...

You're a smart and determined cookie Mia...cheers!!

I feel very priviledged to have found so many wonderful womyn with whom to share my heart...thank you all!!!

[mia]

((((Juliedog & funnyfox)))) thank you both for having the courage to post. It's good to see more and more people post about their own struggles and not be afraid. It always feels comforting to know that there are lots of others out there.

[mia]

((((Gracious Li))))) What can I say?? You know you rock in my book girl. Thanks for all of your gut level honesty. Your posts are always beautiful. Take a breath and let it all go. I look forward to reading more from you and know that we are all here.

[mia]

(((chnacat))) Good to see you post. I was on paxil for a number of years. Besides the weight gain, I too had that numb/flat affect. My psychiatrist said that the SSRI's are known for that. He switched me to effexor, which is in a class all it's own. It affects 3 differen't brain chemistries instead of just seratonin. I no longer have that numbness affect. Of course everyone is different...

[mia]

((((LadyHawk)))) please email me anytime.

[Janet]

((((((((((((((Everyone)))))))))))))))
Just the fact that you all are here is enough some days.
I am grateful to all of you that open up here, and allow me to do the same.
Welcome everyone new.
~janet

[mslisabell]

Thanks Mia, I didn't realize there was a bipolar thread...take care!
Lisa

[LadyHawk280]

(Also posted this question on the bi-polar thread)

I've been having a hell of time feeling nauseous after eating, continual back pains and headaches...I haven't changed my meds but I'm wondering if it's a med reaction...I've been on Paxil for over 5 months and only started to gain weight in the last month...

My psychiatrist didn't seem to think it should be a med buildup but I've got a very finely tuned and strange body chemistry...otherwise I probably wouldn't be on this crap at all!!!! lol...

I'm calling my primary care physician tomorrow but just wondering if any of you ever had delayed med reactions?

I've gotta say that physically feeling like shit is not helping my sunny disposition at all...

[mia]

Originally posted by LadyHawk280
(Also posted this question on the bi-polar thread)

I've been having a hell of time feeling nauseous after eating, continual back pains and headaches...I haven't changed my meds but I'm wondering if it's a med reaction...I've been on Paxil for over 5 months and only started to gain weight in the last month...

My psychiatrist didn't seem to think it should be a med buildup but I've got a very finely tuned and strange body chemistry...otherwise I probably wouldn't be on this crap at all!!!! lol...

I'm calling my primary care physician tomorrow but just wondering if any of you ever had delayed med reactions?

I've gotta say that physically feeling like shit is not helping my sunny disposition at all...

LadyHawk, you must be a cat lover. I was on paxil for a number of years and put on alot of weight. The last couple of years on paxil I started hurting all over.... like arthritis or fibromyalgia (sp)
It hurt to sleep at night and rolling over was painful.

I started taking SamE and it really helped with the pain, but made me edgy. The doctor put me on some pain medication, but I didn't like taking it all the time.

Interestingly, last year I switched doctors and he put me on effexor. After a few months it suddenly dawned on me that all my pain went away. I've heard that some forms of pain like that are treated with anti-depressants. As far as paxil causing pain.... it's possible, but then again it could be something else. If it doesn't go away, I would suggest switching to something else to see if that helps.

[LadyHawk280]

I may get brave and try something else...and I'm with you about the pain medication...I don't really want to add yet another one - I'm already on three different meds...and the med management game is just soooo annoying sometimes...

Thanks for being so kind and supportive and letting me spout off...

[mia]

Scientists Find Gene Linked to Depression

Study of Geneaological Records Of Mormons Leads to Discovery
By THOMAS M. BURTON
Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL


After studying hundreds of Mormon families and their genealogical records, researchers in Utah say they have identified a gene that causes depression -- a finding that could revolutionize treatment of the widespread psychiatric condition.

Discovery of the gene, called DEP1, came from scientists at Myriad Genetics Inc. of Salt Lake City, which in the past isolated the breast-cancer genes BRCA-1 and BRCA-2.

The discovery of those genes enabled doctors to pinpoint and pre-emptively treat women at extremely high risk of developing breast and ovarian cancer.

The DEP1 discovery could lead to the creation of a new class of antidepressants, an effort that is already under way in a venture between Myriad and Abbott Laboratories.

"This is the first definitive report that I am aware of for a depression gene," says Jim Sullivan, Abbott's divisional vice president for neuroscience research. "It's a very exciting discovery."

Current antidepressants such as Prozac, Paxil and Zoloft are generally aimed at increasing levels of serotonin and norepinephrine, chemicals believed to carry electrical messages in the brain. But the DEP1 discovery suggests that there are other neurological chemicals, some produced by the gene itself, involved in the onset of depression. Abbott scientists already are seeking to identify those compounds and determine their role in the disease.

The pharmaceutical industry is scrambling to find an antidepressant that works faster than current drugs, or that helps patients who don't respond well to the present generation of drugs. About 30% of depression patients don't improve with existing drugs, and as many as 50% still suffer some depression symptoms despite medication. Of the roughly 30,000 suicides in the U.S. each year, two-thirds are related to depression, a federal report says.

For drug companies, depression offers a huge market: It afflicts about 30 million Americans, and 70 million people world-wide. Currently, the pharmaceutical industry generates more than $12 billion in annual sales of antidepressants.

Depression has long been believed to be a complex genetic disease, meaning that numerous genes, along with many environmental factors, are thought to play a role. Thus, the road to drug discovery is likely to be a tortuous one. Myriad itself already is searching for other such genes, while other psychiatric geneticists are skeptical that an important drug will necessarily ensue.

"There is a very small number of documented successes with [treatments based on] disease genes for complex genetic disorders, so a healthy skepticism is in order," says Kenneth Kendler, an authority on psychiatric genetics and psychiatry professor at the Medical College of Virginia, in Richmond, Va.

The work by Myriad scientists involved the study of hospital records and genealogical charts of more than 400 Mormon and other Utah families. These families had strong histories of major depression, and three of these families included more than 50 people each suffering from depression.

As with Myriad's earlier work on breast cancer, the company's study was greatly helped by the lifestyle and cultural tendencies of the Mormon Church and its members. For one thing, the church encourages its members to keep detailed genealogical records, which enabled researchers to look back decades or even centuries to detect disease. Mormons also tend to have large numbers of children, increasing the likelihood that a disease would crop up in a generation.

Further, Mormons often intermarry, which keeps the genetic pool purer, hence increasing the statistical power of a study. Even the historical (but now outlawed) practice of polygamy also has enabled researchers to scrutinize the effects of a father's genes when combined with those of multiple wives.

The study of such populations as a means of identifying disease genes was pioneered by population geneticist Mark Skolnick at the University of Utah, now chief scientific officer of Myriad. Scientists at Myriad used a technique of isolating a gene that has mutated in those family members with depression.

Abbott, of North Chicago, Ill., independently has invented a system enabling the company to speedily test the nearly one million compounds in its chemical "library" of possible drugs. Among many portions of that effort, Abbott has created small plates that look like index cards. Each plate is dotted with barely-visible samples of thousands of different chemicals. The plate is then smeared with a sample of, in this case, the proteins related to the depression gene, to see which chemicals have a strong action on the protein.

Abbott believes that any drug which comes out of this effort could work in patients without the DEP1, gene, too. Conversely, existing drugs still could work on patients with the gene, but Abbott hopes that the new pathway will mean more powerful drugs for depression. The company has a large diagnostic division and would also like to develop a lab test that could identify such patients, but this would depend on how powerful a tool the diagnostic test would prove to be.

Dr. Sullivan estimates it will be 18 months to three years before the company could start clinical trials in human patients. Before that, Abbott will test the most powerful compounds in mice and rats.

"This is an early-stage discovery," he says, "but we are excited that we have opened a new pathway to attack depression."

[lostandconfused]

I feel like I don't have anywhere else to turn. Part of me feels like the way I am feeling is going to pass, things will get better but they don't seem to be. They just seem to be getting worse day by day. This is going to be a long story and I hope that someone will take the time to read it and hopefully reply because I am feeling that I am at the end of my rope.

I have been depressed for a while. My ex and I broke up the begining of Dec and immediately I got involved with another woman to make myself feel better. Someone who I would have never gotten involved with if I was myself but she was there and I was needy and I took advantage of that situration, and in turn I was taken advantage of. It took me a couple of weeks to get over that fling and in the meantime I was trying to get over the breakup with my ex, whom I still loved and still do. I broke up with her for no good reason in her mind. In mine I was just tired of the fighting and feeling so inferior. That is neither here nor there right now.

I have had a crush on this woman we'll call her X for a long time. X was dating someone casually for a while and kept telling me how she wanted to break it off, things happened and X and I started dating. It was wonderful. Quite possibly everything I was looking for. She kept telling me everything I wanted to hear. She has now gone back to that woman that she was dating, telling me that she's sorry for hurting me that she's just confused and doesn't know exactly what she wants, that she want's to be with me but she has to "exhaust" all efforts with this other to make sure, to be positive that she doesn't want to be with her before anything else happens between us.

I feel as if I am on a rollercoaster. Literally one day she says she wants me and doesn't want her ex, the next she says she can't date me and wants to try again with her ex. Throughout all this she keeps telling me how much she really likes me and she wants to be with me but she can't right now.

I keep letting women do this to me. I rely so much on how they feel about me to make myself feel better, I feel so incapable of doing it myself. I am not strong enough. So when I get rejected like I did with X the depression starts up again and I get thrown into turmoil and I don't know what to do and moments pass where I feel there is only one option.

So that's the immediate depression. Let's go back to my ex. We were together for quite a while, we lived together, had pets together and because of circumstances she had to move away. We stayed together, we ended up breaking up. I had the pets, she came one day and without me knowing, without me saying goodbye to them she stole them from our house. Left me with nothing. Loss on top of Loss on top of Loss on top of Loss...

I feel so unlucky. I feel so used and manipulated and hurt and lost and confused with nothing in this world to look forward to. I have no plans, no goals, no aspirations. I can't even motivate myself to take a walk just because the weather is nice. I have put so much emphasis on what others think of me and how my life is not my own and revolves around others and making others happy. I know I shouldn't be so upset about X, that people are people and they are going to do what they are going to do and it doesn't always mean that they lied to you it just means that they were confused but it still hurts.

So this leads me to my real problem. As I sit here at work staring outside looking at the piles of snow on the ground I can't help but think what is the point? I am so unlucky in relationships/love that i honestly feel like I will never meet anyone who I will be happy with that will also (the key) be happy with me. I don't want to live my life alone, I don't want to live my life like this. It is becoming too much to handle. I am on medication, I see a theapist and I think it is helping, but I don't know.

I don't think anyone will miss me if I'm gone and that hurts. I don't feel like I mean that much to anyone right now and I don't want that. So many of my so called friends I don't believe would be there if I really needed them. They are sick and tired and I don't blame them of seeing me like this. I feel like I have used them up too much with this depression. I want it to stop any way possible. I want to have people I can count on I want to love someone and have them love me back. I feel like such a bother, it's the worst feeling in the world to have nobody to turn to, nobody who will help you. I am so sick of crying alone or worse still holding back the tears so that people won't shy away from me knowing that I am depressed and not happy-go-lucky, nobody wants to be around a depressed person.

I have no desire to make myself feel better. I just keep digging myself deeper and deeper as if my misery is my comfort. I want to be happy. I want to laugh and giggle and run around in circles hand in hand with someone like in the ads on TV. I never seem to have that though and if I do it is short lived and then the hurt settles in and I feel like this. Honeslty like it would be so much better if I wasn't around anymore. I have hurt so many people and been hurt by so many people I don't want that anymore. 6 feet under seems like a much better alternative than life like this.

I'm hurt, I cry, I smoke, I drink, I cry, I take pills so I can sleep at night, I wake up tired, I go to work and do nothing, i go home I cry and smoke some more. I feel like a miserable human being that is just taking up space in this world.

I'm so scared. This is my plea for help.

[mslisabell]

I know how you feel, and am truly sorry you had to experience that kind of hurt. I recommend right away that you get some help dealing with the grief from a counselor. I know it's hard to talk to a stranger, but life IS worth living. Please, get some help. We here at BF can talk to you, but it's not the same and I don't want you to hurt yourself.

Take one deep breath and let it go slowly. Pick up the phone...find a couselor that can help you get back to being you.

And please, come here anytime...we're here for you as well.

Best,
Lisa (k)

[MadHatter]

I've dealt with depressive episodes for 20+ years now. So believe when I say I feel you're pain I truly do.
In fact, I think you and I have been having an affair with the same woman. I just got off that rollcoaster a couple months ago, and I know how hard it can be. The whole thing really crushed me, and weighs heavily on me still. What has provided me relief was finally cutting myself off from it completely. I have NO contact with her now and sometimes I hate that. But for me, having contact is just pouring salt in a wound.

As for feeling like you're at the end of your rope, I've been there 100s of times. There are many recommended things for getting through that. I will tell you what I do when I run out of everything else. I tell myself one thing which is this, if I want to give up completely, I can do it tomorrow.
A very simple idea which I stole from a 12-Step program. Use it, and it will work in an emergency.

But there is a lot of better help to be had in your community. If you feel yourself to be in a crisis situation, as you sound to be, go to your local emergency room immediately! If you can not get yourself to do that, drag the phone book out and look in the front for the Emergency or 911 page. There should be a number listed for Suicide and Crisis Counseling, the numbers listed usually will connect your to an anonymous service available 24hrs a day.

You must get help for yourself. While we on this website can lend support, sympathy and information, we can only do so to a certain extent. We can not get help for you, you have to participate.
You'll be in my prayers tonight. Please take care!

- Mad

[lostandconfused]

I was so stupid on Monday night. After I wrote my msg earlier that day I read it and re-read it and as I read I started feeling more and more sorry for myself. I went home deciding this is it, no more pain I'm just going to end it. 10 sleeping pills 15 advil and 4 beers later I started getting scared. My notes all lined up on the coffee table one to my ex, one to my parents and one to my friends. All of them saying how sorry I was for being such a failure and please don't blame yourselves it was my fault for not being strong enough. Through my fear I decided to try to call one more person to help me. She calmed me down but the damage was already done, I fel asleep thinking and hoping I wouldn't wake up.

In the morning I was still here, and my anxiety was overwhelming me, I called in sick and again I tried, 20 advil, 10 sleeping pills and 2 beers. My stomach gave out on me and I vomited it all out. I spent most of the day crying until the early afternoon when once again I tried, 20 sleeping pills 10 advil. I just slept. Christ I can't even do that right.

My episode has passed I think. At least in so far as wanting to off myself. But I'm still depressed and I still have the anxiety that I can't seem to shake. I keep thinking about all of this rationally what is it that is triggering me? I really like X and I wanted her to be with me so I'm sad that she dumped me not because she didn't like me but because she wanted to make sure she didn't want her ex. It might have been better if she simply didn't like me. If she just didn't "see us together" but she did. I feel rejected and completely humiliated. I am scared to go to the clubs for fear of running into the two of them together. That would destroy me to see that but if I don't go out then I will never meet any new friends or lovers. I don't want to live as a hermit but I don't want this pain either.

And my ex doesn't want to speak to me or have anything to do with me, she and I were together for a long time, nobody knows as much about me as she does and now she's gone from my life. I never wanted that. I just needed some time to figure some stuff out and I guess I took too much time.

I use people to brighten my life and when they are gone big chunks of myself are gone with them. I open up too quickly. I expect too much too soon. These are faults I know I have, yet I can never stop myself from feeling or doing them. I don't guard myself enough and because of that I am constantly greiving over something or someone. I think it is pretty pathetic of myself to answer a question such as "what do you want in life?" by saying "I want to be in love and be happy." I don't search for a good job, or health, friends or riches, I just want to be in love. And I think I am cursed I am destined never to find love again. I know this is a silly irrational thought that everything happens for a reason and there is someone out there for me but I can't help but feel that I've lost my chance and not just once. But I have been given many chances and I managed to screw them all up. It's amazing that a feeling such as love can make you feel wonderful and horrible at the same time.

Everyone tells me i need to find a hobby. God I'm sick of hearing that. I don't want a hobby. Hobbies are what you do when you are old and retired, collecting stamps building model cars, I want to be out with people. I also know that I should be alone right now. I know that there is too much going on in my head to be getting into any type of relationship but it's hard to step back if it's dropped in your lap. That combined with the fact that I don't want to be alone. I want to wake up with someone next to me and say goodnight to them as well. I don't want to be alone but I am.

I am so pathetic.
I feel like a total failure.
I feel so alone.

[Juliedog]

As Mad Hatter already stated, we are here in this group to lend an ear and offer support. However, you are in a severe personal crisis. You must participate in actively seeking help from trained professionals. They will empower you to recover from the crisis in ways that a peer support group such as this cannot. It is clear to me that you want help by telling us your story. Please take the next step for yourself and call the suicide prevention hotline in your area or report to the nearest emergecy room. When things look as bleak as they seem to you now, the professionals can help get you through to a place where things will seem better. Meanwhile, I will be sending positive energy your way.

[mia]

(((Lost))) how old are you sweetie? it sounds like you need a good dose of therapy and meds. I'd lay off the beer and sleeping pills. I agree with the others on calling the emergency numbers. they can put you in contact with available resources in your area too. a good support group is a must. honestly, I don't know where I would be without my friends and family who stood by myself & my son ..... life is a tough row to hoe sometimes :)

one phrase that has always kept me going is "this too shall pass." It always does....

[FemmeBabyGrrl]

Totally agreeing with Julie & Mia here. We definetly can lend an ear. But when depression goes that far, you should get some outside help from a counsler/therapist.

Please seriously consider it.

AND DON'T TRY THAT BEER & PILLS THING AGAIN!!! Or we'll all have to come over there and give you a good talking too!

[lostandconfused]

I appreciate the kind words. I am in therapy and on meds. I probably need more but this is all I can do right now.

I just wish I could shake the anxiety that I feel every morning waking up. It feels like a blender is in my stomach on full power. It doesn't go away for almost 4 hours even with the anti-anxiety meds. Then I get myself worked up a bit after noon thinking too much about things, about how my life doesn't feel like my own right now. How if I could only go back in time, not even that far... maybe just a couple of months or weeks, I could change things and right now would be so different. I might just be happy.

I miss my ex. She's happy now with someone else. That hurts me so much. It wasn't supposed to be this way. We were supposed to get back together and be happy.

I'm just so confused.

I want something to go in my favor, I need that more than anything right now.

[jelli]

::: sigh :::

[Gracious Li]

Jelli?
So little said so much. I'm worried ...
(w) ({) (}) (f)

[FeelTheKiss]

Well Hello All,

Its been a very long time since I started this post and a longer time since I've actually posted. Ijust wanted to give you all a little update.

I had a little episode a few weeks back and thought I was having a heart attack. I was taken to the local hospital here and I was diagnoised with Panic Attacks. Well, since then I have gotten myself into a therapy program here called Genesis. I have a wonderful therapist named Lois and she is helping me with a lot of the problems I have. I also had my first sesssion with my new psychiatrist, Dr. Cameron. I have a problem dealing with males in authority but he is trying to help me so I'll just go with the flow, as it is said.

He has taken me off the Remeron and upped my Seroquel. It will take a few days to start to feel the effects but everything is hopeful. I'm taking one day at a time and I have my good days and my bad but I'm doing ok for now.

I just wanted to let you all know I'm still alive and kicking but now I;m fighting back. I'm not going to let this get the better of me. Mia, Thank you for all your support. I really appreciate everything. I will keep you all updated as often as I can. Love to you all.

Tae
(k) (k)

[mia]

(((FTK))) good to hear back from you sweetie... yikes about the panic attacks! A good friend of mine has those, so I've heard the horror stories. Did you start getting those since the move?

Good to hear that you found a good therapist and pdoc. Is seroquel all that he has you on? Lots of questions.... My son was on that for awhile, until they switched him to something else. Hugs to you sweetie! and It's good to see you again.

[FeelTheKiss]

(((((((((((mia)))))))))

Hiya Hun,

Well, the Seroquel is just one of the anti-depressants Im on. They took me off the Remeron because it made me feel like I was jumping out of my skin. I'm still on the Effexor and the Valium. But being off that other one makes me feel a lot better.

The panic attacks are something that isn't new to me. I just haven't had one in many years. With the therapy, a lot of things are coming out that I had forgotten or chose to forget and I think that has a lot to do with them. I was on Lorazapam but the pdr didn't like the combination of the Valium and the Lorazapam, seeing that they are used for the same things. So for right now I'm just on the Valium. We'll see how its going.

I'm not taking the pain meds anymore either. So thats a good thing. Like I said before I'm just trying to take things one step at a time and see where they lead me. Thanks for the quick response though. It feels good to be remembered. :)

I'm am so glad that I started this thread. Like I said before it was just suppose to be a sounding board for me but as I've read, its been helpful, I hope, for others as well. I just hope that we can keep it going for all that need a little help to make it through their lives. ((((((mia)))))) Talk to you soon. Love you all.

Tae (k) (k)

[mia]

New York Times

July 18, 2003


Gene Is Linked to Susceptibility to Depression

By MARY DUENWALD

cientists have identified a gene that may help explain why some people become depressed in response to the stresses of life and others skate by relatively unscathed. The gene, which comes in two forms, or alleles, can either protect people from depression or make them more vulnerable, researchers report today in the journal Science. In the study, people who experienced job loss, death in the family, abuse or other traumas were much more likely to develop depression if they possessed two copies of the short allele. Those with two copies of the long allele (pronounced uh-LEEL) were able to withstand such events without becoming depressed."No matter how many stressful events they had in a five-year period, they were no more likely to become depressed than people who had no stressful events at all," said Dr. Terrie E. Moffitt, a psychologist at the University of Wisconsin and King's College London, who collaborated on the study with scientists in Britain and New Zealand. People who have inherited the short allele from one parent and the long one from the other, the researchers found, are moderately vulnerable to depression. The results tie together two of the greatest risk factors for depression."The evidence that stressful life events increase the risk of depression has been strong for about a decade," said Dr. Kenneth Kendler, a psychiatrist at Virginia Commonwealth University, in Richmond, who was not connected to the study."We also know that depression has a moderate level of heritability — about half your risk of depression comes from your genes," he said. "The question has been, do these risk factors add or do they multiply? The answer is that they multiply."The new findings also help explain the sharp differences in the way individuals react to stress."Almost all of us know people who are fairly stress free," Dr. Kendler said. "They like to sky-dive. Or they work as emergency-room physicians. With others, when the boss gives them a bad evaluation, they're upset for a week."The study followed 847 New Zealanders from birth to age 26. Seventeen percent of the subjects carried two copies of the short allele, 31 percent had two copies of the long allele and 51 percent had one of each. Over the years, the researchers tracked each subject's exposure to stressful events like long-term unemployment, debt problems, trouble in intimate relationships, homelessness, disabling injuries and physical or sexual abuse. Fifteen percent of the subjects suffered four or more such crises at ages 21 to 26. Within that group, 43 percent of those with two copies of the short allele developed depression. Thirty-three percent of those with one short and one long allele did. But only 17 percent of those with two copies of the long gene developed depression, about the same number as would be expected to have depression had they experienced no crises at all. A certain amount of depression arises independently of stressful events, Dr. Moffitt noted. Nearly twice as many women as men suffer from depression. Yet women were found no more likely than men to carry the short allele. Perhaps, Dr. Moffitt said, women's vulnerability to depression is not connected to the way they respond to stressful events."There's nothing about this gene interacting with stress that accounts for the sex difference," Dr. Moffitt said. Among those who suffered the most stressful events, the subjects with the short alleles were also more likely to consider or attempt suicide. Only 4 percent of those with the long alleles thought of killing themselves, compared with 11 percent of those with the short ones. The long alleles also seemed to shield those who experienced abuse during childhood — one subject in 10 — from depression in adulthood, the researchers found. The gene, known as 5-HTT, has been a focus of depression studies because it contains the code to produce a protein that escorts the chemical messenger serotonin across the spaces between brain cells, or synapses, and then clears away the leftover serotonin. Drugs like Prozac, Paxil, Zoloft and Celexa, which are widely effective in treating depression, work by acting on the serotonin system. Earlier studies in mice and monkeys have shown a connection between the 5-HTT gene and anxiety. Last year, researchers at the National Institute of Mental Health found that people with two copies of the short allele were more likely than others to become anxious when shown pictures of scary faces.The short allele produces the same protein as the long one, but less of it. As a result, Dr. Moffitt said, it manages serotonin less efficiently. The study suggests that among people who suffer a series of stressful events, the gene could predict who will suffer depression about as well as a bone mineral density test can predict who will suffer a fractured hip, the researchers said. Still, they said it was too early to use 5-HTT as a diagnostic test. The study must be repeated, and other genes that play a role in vulnerability to depression must identified.

[BlackLeather]

I read this and thought I would post it a few places. Just an interesting read.

March 22, 2004 -- The FDA is issuing a warning about the possibility of worsening depression or suicidal thoughts in people, particularly children, who take any of 10 popular antidepressants, especially at the beginning of treatment or when the doses are increased or decreased.


The FDA has sent a letter to drug manufacturers requesting labeling changes on these antidepressants -- warning of possible suicide, worsening depression, anxiety, and panic attacks in adults and children.

Antidepressants involved in this warning label request are:

Prozac (also sold generically as fluoxetine)
Zoloft
Paxil
Luvox
Celexa
Lexapro
Wellbutrin
Effexor
Serzone
Remeron

"We don't know that the drugs are responsible for these behavioral changes, but nonetheless we're telling physicians and families to be aware of this and that if the behaviors do emerge, to get treatment right away," said Russell Katz, a director with the FDA's Center for Drug Evaluation and Research, in a news teleconference today.


The proposed warning label will "include information about behavioral changes that may occur in patients who are prescribed antidepressant drugs," said Katz.


"This applies to adult and pediatric patients and involves the potential for suicidal thinking or suicidal behaviors and warns the physician and family about any behaviors that might emerge that haven't been experienced before," he added.


But the FDA stopped short of recommending people discontinue taking their antidepressants.


"We specifically decided not to tell people not to use these drugs," said Katz. "We don't think that is necessary at this point."


In addition to looking for signs of worsening depression, the following symptoms may also be a sign of a problem:


Anxiety
Agitation
Panic attacks
Insomnia
Irritability
Hostility
Impulsivity
Severe restlessness
Mania in both adults and children being treated with antidepressants for major depression

If these changes appear, treatment should be evaluated, the FDA says. Medications may need to be discontinued when symptoms are severe, begin abruptly, or if they signal a new disorder.


There also is concern for people who have bipolar disorder (manic depression) but don't know it. Antidepressants have the potential for provoking a manic episode in these people, the FDA says. Doctors, patients, and family members should be on the lookout for any symptoms of mania, including feeling extremely happy or very irritable, inflated self-esteem, not needing as much sleep as usual, talking, or being more active than usual.

Reviewing Studies of Children


The FDA has been closely reviewing studies of antidepressants in children for the past year after an initial report on studies of Paxil and other drugs suggested an increased risk of suicidal thoughts in children given antidepressants. No suicides occurred in any of the trials, the FDA reports.


The analysis has involved 25 controlled trials with 4,000 children taking antidepressants, said Katz. "Those reviews are ongoing."


Today's action "arose from an unexpected observation in some studies of an apparent excess of emotionability, a catch-all term ... that includes suicidal [thoughts]," said Robert Temple, MD, the FDA's director of medical policy.


However, closer examination has shown that the accounts are unclear -- whether certain behaviors reported were actual suicide attempts or other self-injurious behavior that was not suicide-related.


"As we've gone into the studies in detail, it's become evident that the terms used were highly varied and [the studies] not very well done," Temple said.


Experts at Columbia University in New York are providing an independent review of the studies, looking carefully at descriptions of these events to determine whether those cases represent suicidal behavior.


"We hope to have a much better idea whether these drugs are effective and whether or not they do cause suicidal symptoms," said Katz.


"There is an ongoing awareness that children are particularly vulnerable, that they need additional protection, and that we make sure that all the protections are in place," said Dianne Murphy, MD, the FDA's director of Pediatric Therapeutics.

Do you have more questions about antidepressantsquestions about antidepressants? See what two experts told WebMD.
Reviewing Studies of Children


The FDA has been closely reviewing studies of antidepressants in children for the past year after an initial report on studies of Paxil and other drugs suggested an increased risk of suicidal thoughts in children given antidepressants. No suicides occurred in any of the trials, the FDA reports.


The analysis has involved 25 controlled trials with 4,000 children taking antidepressants, said Katz. "Those reviews are ongoing."


Today's action "arose from an unexpected observation in some studies of an apparent excess of emotionability, a catch-all term ... that includes suicidal [thoughts]," said Robert Temple, MD, the FDA's director of medical policy.


However, closer examination has shown that the accounts are unclear -- whether certain behaviors reported were actual suicide attempts or other self-injurious behavior that was not suicide-related.


"As we've gone into the studies in detail, it's become evident that the terms used were highly varied and [the studies] not very well done," Temple said.


Experts at Columbia University in New York are providing an independent review of the studies, looking carefully at descriptions of these events to determine whether those cases represent suicidal behavior.


"We hope to have a much better idea whether these drugs are effective and whether or not they do cause suicidal symptoms," said Katz.


"There is an ongoing awareness that children are particularly vulnerable, that they need additional protection, and that we make sure that all the protections are in place," said Dianne Murphy, MD, the FDA's director of Pediatric Therapeutics.

Do you have more questions about antidepressantsquestions about antidepressants? See what two experts told WebMD.

[funnyfox]

What's amazing (and scary) is that out of the 10 drugs on the FDA list I have been on 5 of them at some point in my life!! :s
And it seems there is no end in site at least for me.

ff

[lil-lindsey]

tried once...
thought about it...constantly for all of high school.

the only thing i ever did though was think of the one person that i know i meant the world to at the time. your girlfriend, your mom, dad, sister, best friend...it got to the point that even my cat was keeping me from killing myself. as long as that one person is there still, you should still be there too.

things will always get better. life does suck...its pretty unfair. but you have to believe that it will get better. something good will happen

[YourHeartsDesire]

Originally posted by lil-lindsey
tried once...
thought about it...constantly for all of high school.

the only thing i ever did though was think of the one person that i know i meant the world to at the time. your girlfriend, your mom, dad, sister, best friend...it got to the point that even my cat was keeping me from killing myself. as long as that one person is there still, you should still be there too.

things will always get better. life does suck...its pretty unfair. but you have to believe that it will get better. something good will happen

It doesn't really ever get better..... you take the meds, the hospitalizations, the therapy...but it's always there, in the back of your mind...just waiting for the oppurtunity to arise. I've debated suicide for years and as soon as I figure out the easy , clean way...I'm done

As for friends family etc. They didn't ask to be lifetime members of this rollercoaster either......

[Girlygirl65]

Femme Princess,

I'm sure you didn't ask for the rollercoaster either. Rest assured you are not the only one on it with your friends and family. I've been down this road many, many times myself although I didn't know what was actualy going on until about 15 years ago.

I hope that you are still holding on---there is never a "clean" way out. I've thought and thought about it for many years and every year when I turn a year older, I marvel that I "made it" another birthday. I started that at the age of 15 and next year I will be 40. Maybe I'm unimaginative or maybe, somewhere deep inside, I really want to keep going.

I hope the same is true for you. Hold on tight and never let go. Based on what I'm reading in this thread, you have plenty of us to hold on to.

[SpinxxieFairy]

It is scary to see all the lists of diff meds out there.. what we have to do.. and I am trying to do, is educate myself on choices. My Shrink has been great, giving me options on what I can take. I was on zoloft for 5 years, Luvox for 4 - tried wellbutrin for a couple of weeks (which made me a super bitch), now the zoloft faded out. I am not on Effexor at 150mgs, it works but not optimally - tried 225 but the side effects were worse then the depression.. so back to 150 and dexdrine added... weee.. I have had energy I forgot existed..

Only piece of advise... investigate, question, and then question again.. Dr. Ivan's Depression Central is good..
Thanks for this Thead!
SpinxxieFairy(l) (*) (*) (*)

[ozmel8]

and the other thing with meds that lots of people don't realize is that they work differently for each person. So, if your best friend is taking something and it works great for them, don't assume it will also do wonders for you. I've been on Wellbutrin off and on for 7 or 8 years now and they've tried me on other things, Prosac, Zoloft, etc. My best friend takes Zoloft and it helps her...me, it did nothing for the depression and made me horribly physically ill, thought I was dying, half of my body would go numb all at once, violently nausious, etc. It took the docs a month to figure out it was the Zoloft and as soon as I stopped taking it, I was all better. As well as Wellbutrin works for me, I know other people who it didn't work for or made sick or all kinds of other things. So remember, you have to find the right drug for you and your body and your freaky chemicals...it may take some time, which can suck, but eventually you and your doc will figure it out.

[SkyFallsDown]

Hmmm... Found this thread... So I feel like posting...

I've been in and out of a major depression since I was about 14... Granted, I'm only just about to be 19, but that's still a long time... It's still a lot of bullshit... I used to be such a strong person. Nothing could ever get to me. But then, I dun know what happened... I came out... I came out my freshman year of highschool... I was stalked, and harrassed... But not as much as some people have experienced. Just enough to break me down. Enough to kill pieces of me day by day... Until I was nothing... After that year I got bad into pills, bad into cutting... Things just always happened to bring me down, when I found something to bring me up. I've been moved all over the damn country in a matter of a year... Taken away from the only people who helped keep me sane.. So I got into cutting again... Ha... I lived in Florida, and wore long sleeve shirts everyday... My parents never even noticed... They were fuckin coked up... Ha... That's happened my whole life. I have a family of alcoholics, and drug users.... And the drama... Oh it's everywhere... I've had so many breakdowns... I used to have nights where I would just sit and cry... Sit and cut... Sit and just lose my mind... I let the weight of everything bear down on my shoulders and let it build up, and up, until it finally collapsed on top of me... And I'd lose it.. I started getting high, and drinking, and doin nitrous.... I would just drown it all away. When I drug myself away from all that, and I would still lose it... I just stopped talking to people. There was a time once, where I didn't talk to anyone for four months nearly... I've kinda did that recently. Everyone I used to call friend, I've distanced myself from them. I couldn't take it anymore. I'm the type of person who will take everybody elses shit, and worry for them, along with my own shit... I just couldn't do it anymore. Ha... That only added to the bullshit though, cos they're a bunch of shady mother fuckers and tried everything they could to get me to not go... But it didn't work. Now I just bear the weight of my fucking family, something happening every week, almost everyday anymore... I can just barely take it anymore. I know something has to be wrong with me... Cos I shouldn't be this depressed all the time... But I dun wanna see a doctor... I dun wanna pay some guy to tell me I'm fucked, when I already know it... I just wanted to vent, and so I did it here... Things have been shitty lately and I feel myself wanting to go back to getting high, which i just gave up in may... Or cutting... Which I stopped in March. I just need an escape and I have none anymore... I feel like just running away from it all, but I can't... Cos I know things would only get worse if I did...

Ah, I am going to stop writing this now... Just some ramblings from my depressed mind.

[FallingUnderStars]

hey sky.. i know kinda of what u are goin thro witt the cuttting and the drugs...
i had no friends in middle schoo iw as a loner.. and got really depressed and started cutting and smoking... then i meet some friends but they werent the best of friends...i just wanted to be accepted by some1 and iwas... but it was the drugies... and i started gettin into all sorts of drugs and everything... goin to raves... i stoped doin drugs prolly about 9-10 grade... i'm now in 12th grade... and i still have episodes for a bad acid trip i had... and from bein raped while i was under the influinced of drugs... i was the lowest i could possibly be... i wouldn't eat or talk to anyone... i was just too depressed to... i just couldn't take much and even tried killin myself for how much i fucked my life up and everything... i've been put on prozac but i refuse to take it... cuz i just got my life off of bein revolved around drugs but now i have to go back...i don't think so... i'mnot lettin my life be revolved around a stupid pill... i know it can help me but i just wont... its not the fact that i hate the thought of it... its the fact that i hate me.. cuz i know if i take it i wil want to take more and more and get addicted to them... and do stpuid stuf again.. i duno... rihtnow... i'mjut at the bottum and i want to cut soo bad.. but i haven't... in a while... i just i duno anyone got anotha way i can let out my anger and depression by not cuttin??

[fastNfurious]

and the other thing with meds that lots of people don't realize is that they work differently for each person. So, if your best friend is taking something and it works great for them, don't assume it will also do wonders for you. I've been on Wellbutrin off and on for 7 or 8 years now and they've tried me on other things, Prosac, Zoloft, etc. My best friend takes Zoloft and it helps her...me, it did nothing for the depression and made me horribly physically ill, thought I was dying, half of my body would go numb all at once, violently nausious, etc. It took the docs a month to figure out it was the Zoloft and as soon as I stopped taking it, I was all better. As well as Wellbutrin works for me, I know other people who it didn't work for or made sick or all kinds of other things. So remember, you have to find the right drug for you and your body and your freaky chemicals...it may take some time, which can suck, but eventually you and your doc will figure it out.

I too, have struggled with major depression on and off for a good part of my life. It got really bad several years ago and I was put on Serzone, which worked very well for me. For those worried about side affects, one of the great things about Serzone is that it does not usually have any sexual side affects or sleep disturbances. May not work for everyone, but it sure did for me. I haven't had to take any meds for awhile now and hopefully won't have to again - I found a treatment of a non-medical sort :)